Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post - Photo thread: ROYALTY SWORDS , ARMS & ARMOUR from around the world

B.I · 23rd February 2005, 09:43 AM

hi karni,
no, i think that the dagger in the miniature just backs up the quote from jahangirs memoirs -
''to make dagger-hilts of a shape that was approved at this time''
i think that with the al saba dagger, the wallace dagger and the one displayed in the miniature which shows a slightly different form of decoration, it shows the popularity of this style of weapon during jahangirs reign. as the 3 pieces show a very high quality and a display of wealth, it would be hard to assume that the al saba piece was the one described and revered by jahangir. i would say it probably was, but who knows.
what jahangir actually said was -

''one hilt came out in such a way as to create astonishment. it turned out of all the seven colours, and some of the flowers looked as if a skillful painter had depicted them in black lines round it with a wonder-working pencil. in short, it was so delicate that i wish it never to be apart from me for a moment. of all the gems of great price that are in the treasury i consider it the most precious. on thursday i girded it auspiciously with joy around my waist, and the masters who in their completion had exercised great skill and taken pains were rewarded, Ustad Puran with the gift of an elephant, a dress of honour, and a golden bracelet for the wrist, which the people of india call kara, and Kalyan with the title of 'aja ib-dast' (wondrous hand), and increased mansab (rank), a dress of honour, and a jewelled bracelet, and in the smae way everyone according to his circumstances and skill recieved favours.''

welch says the al saba dagger could have been made by these two masters, but doesnt actually commit to it being the one described in these memoirs. maybe it was, but i am not sure what the seven colours he referred to was.
either way, i think all can be connected to the courts of jahangir, which is provenance enough.

23rd February 2005, 09:43 AM	#21
B.I Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 485	hi karni, no, i think that the dagger in the miniature just backs up the quote from jahangirs memoirs - ''to make dagger-hilts of a shape that was approved at this time'' i think that with the al saba dagger, the wallace dagger and the one displayed in the miniature which shows a slightly different form of decoration, it shows the popularity of this style of weapon during jahangirs reign. as the 3 pieces show a very high quality and a display of wealth, it would be hard to assume that the al saba piece was the one described and revered by jahangir. i would say it probably was, but who knows. what jahangir actually said was - ''one hilt came out in such a way as to create astonishment. it turned out of all the seven colours, and some of the flowers looked as if a skillful painter had depicted them in black lines round it with a wonder-working pencil. in short, it was so delicate that i wish it never to be apart from me for a moment. of all the gems of great price that are in the treasury i consider it the most precious. on thursday i girded it auspiciously with joy around my waist, and the masters who in their completion had exercised great skill and taken pains were rewarded, Ustad Puran with the gift of an elephant, a dress of honour, and a golden bracelet for the wrist, which the people of india call kara, and Kalyan with the title of 'aja ib-dast' (wondrous hand), and increased mansab (rank), a dress of honour, and a jewelled bracelet, and in the smae way everyone according to his circumstances and skill recieved favours.'' welch says the al saba dagger could have been made by these two masters, but doesnt actually commit to it being the one described in these memoirs. maybe it was, but i am not sure what the seven colours he referred to was. either way, i think all can be connected to the courts of jahangir, which is provenance enough.