Quote:
|
Originally Posted by A.alnakkas
Rumh رمح and Rum روم have nothing in common. Arabs do not call spears Rumi, not in the past and not in the present. Rumh, Shalfa and Gena are the names most commonly used through out the Arab world. And the name for spear did not get passed down to a fire arm. This is pure misinformation that has no linguistic or historic background. I advice forum moderates to nominate anyone who can speak and read Arabic to moderate such misinformation that somehow get passed out as facts.
On topic: Arab spears are an interesting topic, the most interesting part about them is that ones you'd find used by Arabs in Syria or Nejd or as far south as Yemen, would look nearly identical thus likely pointing to being sourced by majority from a single producing region. Blades vary, some I have shown in the forum with Qama blades. Some have good quality steel but most are iron, with a few rare ones with bronze spear heads fitted to an iron shaft.
Elgood mentions a production centre in Iraq and historically, AlTaif in alHassa is famed for producing a type of spears, with some reference going back to pre islamic times.
Lances too are also produced locally, with some confused for spear butts.
|
Wonderfully authoritative and informative insight, especially in the perspective that there is more consistency in forms of spears and lances throughout the Arab world. I have always regarded that definition as far broader in definition than Arabia alone, as the Arabs of course populated many other places significantly.
With the terms noted Rumh, Shalfa and Gena, it seems these are indeed proper terms used, however, though I am no linguist, there does not seem to be any documented or reliable etymological explanation for loan words used locally, or in various contexts.
For example, Elgood notes terms used to describe various swords (by blades it seems typically) as the term 'shintayan' MAY refer to St. Etienne(France); or the term 'majar' MAY refer to 'Hungarian' (blades often seen on swords in Arabia), while 'al Hindi' of course refers to Indian.
Is it not possible that colloquially, in this manner of loan words describing certain character of a weapon or even origin of a term might extend in the same manner to 'rumh' as rumi' . Often such uses are nearly impossible to detect etymologically, as has often been seen in countless examples.
With the extension of the term for spear/lance colloquially, in military contexts, as I know Ibrahiim is deeply familiar, terms are often used toward weapons in slang or vernular use which are obviously not the proper one for the weapon. A heavy machine gun is often termed a 'saw', while obviously not the cutting tool..and so on . As the Rumh was a traditional weapon used by tribesmen, why would such troops not use a traditional term colloquially referring to their rifles?
Clearly these kinds of uses are not known to many, nor commonly, outside such military circles, and are not documented accordingly.
It is interesting to see perspective from clearly different sides, and to be able to learn more from them. I am under the impression that Bedouin tribes vary dramatically throughout the regions they occupy, and am curious about not only the terms they would use for these type weapons, which also vary in use and form as well.
Also, I am curious about the idea of a central location for production of these weapons, as my impression of the spears/lances used by various tribal populations were often repurposed and sometimes composite items produced locally. With the differences in semantics and perhaps dialect, it seems there might be any number of local terms or expressions....at least that is the way it is in many other cultural spheres.