Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post - Suggestions for care and respect of Javanese and Balinese Keris.

Mudi · 13th July 2006, 02:31 AM

I just read Lei Shen Dao and I am happy that someone could explain in good English. May I also say when drawing keris to keep it out and away from your face and pointed away from your face. In Indonesia we often give a silent ask for permission to the keris to remove it from sarong.

Pak Maisey, with respect I do not think I can discuss Islam in Indonesia with you more. Again with no anger but with respect anthropologists are not trained to know what is in the hearts and minds of Indonesian Muslims.

You wrote

The reasons for an Indonesian, especially a person of Javanese cultural background, undertaking the Haj are perhaps not as clear cut as they may seem to be.I will not comment further on this matter in the open Forum, but I am prepared to comment privately.

Pak if I not understand what you write I am sorry but you have already commented publicly and you suggest the reasons Muslims in Indonesia pilgrim Haj is not for devotion to Islam. I will not take offending if you explain what you suggest. If you open the door you should be able to go through it.

Back to keris you write about bad luck keris. You write

If the dukun is successful, the bad luck will cease, if he is unsuccessful and the bad luck continues, the owner of the keris will search for somebody who is prepared to take the keris as a gift. When a new owner accepts the keris as a gift, clearly he does not believe that it can bring him bad luck:- if he did, he would not accept it.

I think you mean to write

When a new owner accepts the keris as a gift, clearly he does not know that it can bring him bad luck:- if he did, he would not accept it.

Pak Nechesh wrote

Catholicism does not embrace animism as it sees these spirits as only being evil and destructive.

You mean that about exorcism. I understand. But what about the holy spirit and the belief that some religious statues and relics are taken over by the good spirit and miracles happen?

Thank you for your patience.

13th July 2006, 02:31 AM	#25
Mudi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Makassar, (Ujung Pandang), Sulawesi, Indonesia Posts: 38	I just read Lei Shen Dao and I am happy that someone could explain in good English. May I also say when drawing keris to keep it out and away from your face and pointed away from your face. In Indonesia we often give a silent ask for permission to the keris to remove it from sarong. Pak Maisey, with respect I do not think I can discuss Islam in Indonesia with you more. Again with no anger but with respect anthropologists are not trained to know what is in the hearts and minds of Indonesian Muslims. You wrote The reasons for an Indonesian, especially a person of Javanese cultural background, undertaking the Haj are perhaps not as clear cut as they may seem to be.I will not comment further on this matter in the open Forum, but I am prepared to comment privately. Pak if I not understand what you write I am sorry but you have already commented publicly and you suggest the reasons Muslims in Indonesia pilgrim Haj is not for devotion to Islam. I will not take offending if you explain what you suggest. If you open the door you should be able to go through it. Back to keris you write about bad luck keris. You write If the dukun is successful, the bad luck will cease, if he is unsuccessful and the bad luck continues, the owner of the keris will search for somebody who is prepared to take the keris as a gift. When a new owner accepts the keris as a gift, clearly he does not believe that it can bring him bad luck:- if he did, he would not accept it. I think you mean to write When a new owner accepts the keris as a gift, clearly he does not know that it can bring him bad luck:- if he did, he would not accept it. Pak Nechesh wrote Catholicism does not embrace animism as it sees these spirits as only being evil and destructive. You mean that about exorcism. I understand. But what about the holy spirit and the belief that some religious statues and relics are taken over by the good spirit and miracles happen? Thank you for your patience.