Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post - A sociological and anthropological question

Jim McDougall · 16th March 2005, 03:46 AM

Hello Antonio,
First of all I would like to join the others in welcoming you to the forum!
It appears you are already well known to quite a few of our members and it is wonderful to have you join us.There is a continually expanding core of knowledge and expertise here that grows with discussions and sharing information, and especially the steady addition of new members that share in our passion to learn.

It is wonderful to see the questions you have asked here! How could anyone resist responding to trying to remember what compelled us into this very esoteric and thoroughly empassioned obsession.

I would have to join many of the others reaching back to being a young boy, in my case being fascinated by tales of pirates, swashbucklers and cavalry charges! However even before being aware of these, I was always obsessed with organizing and learning, mostly history. I think from the time I realized that the swords I saw in dictionaries seemed to all have certain differences, and of course seeing them in the movies, led me to trying to catalog the various forms I saw. As I grew older and more interested in military history, I found several books of British military regulation swords. I was fascinated with trying to match the ones in the books to some I had found in old shops. I remember finding an old sabre at a swap meet and matching it to a photo in the book..I was hooked!

I think that the interest in ethnographic weapons came much later, as the regulation patterns became mundane and the ethnographic specimens that always appeared mostly as trophies or souveniers of military campaigns seemed elusive and mysterious. One such item is a pata that I have owned for over 30 years and seems to have taunted me in that time to discover more about it

As I studied more of military campaigns, the exotic and exciting places described became much more interesting than the typically bland military operations described and the tribal cultures became more and more fascinating and three dimensional. I learned that the ignorantly used term 'savages' was pitifully misplaced in most cases, and respresented simply gross misunderstanding of these cultures, and worse, the typically complete apathy often seen in trying to understand them.

I think what I have always found most frustrating is that in degree, the same apathy still resides often in the studies of anthropology, ethnography and related subjects when it comes to the study of weapons that are often virtually icons of the cultures studied. This is primarily of course related to not only the paranoia of political correctness, but the unfortunate increase in violence that has steadily permeated the world.
While many museums have put into storage valuable collections of weapons, and the topics of the importance of certain weapons culturally are often avoided in much published material, we here have sought to discover and preserve all we can of the histories of these weapons. We can only hope that better understanding of the importance of these weapons as important features of material culture rather than negative implements may bring them into the proper perspective.

I would leave the details of the more specific aspects of your questions on the keris and magical connotations imbued in these weapons to the outstanding scholars on that subject who reside here, and we have the best!!! However I did want to address the broader scope of your excellent questions and would like to thank you for placing them here. I know that it has not only reminded me of, but reinforced why I am here, and very proud to be in the distinguished company of the membership of this forum.

With very best regards,
Jim

16th March 2005, 03:46 AM	#20
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,747	Hello Antonio, First of all I would like to join the others in welcoming you to the forum! It appears you are already well known to quite a few of our members and it is wonderful to have you join us.There is a continually expanding core of knowledge and expertise here that grows with discussions and sharing information, and especially the steady addition of new members that share in our passion to learn. It is wonderful to see the questions you have asked here! How could anyone resist responding to trying to remember what compelled us into this very esoteric and thoroughly empassioned obsession. I would have to join many of the others reaching back to being a young boy, in my case being fascinated by tales of pirates, swashbucklers and cavalry charges! However even before being aware of these, I was always obsessed with organizing and learning, mostly history. I think from the time I realized that the swords I saw in dictionaries seemed to all have certain differences, and of course seeing them in the movies, led me to trying to catalog the various forms I saw. As I grew older and more interested in military history, I found several books of British military regulation swords. I was fascinated with trying to match the ones in the books to some I had found in old shops. I remember finding an old sabre at a swap meet and matching it to a photo in the book..I was hooked! I think that the interest in ethnographic weapons came much later, as the regulation patterns became mundane and the ethnographic specimens that always appeared mostly as trophies or souveniers of military campaigns seemed elusive and mysterious. One such item is a pata that I have owned for over 30 years and seems to have taunted me in that time to discover more about it As I studied more of military campaigns, the exotic and exciting places described became much more interesting than the typically bland military operations described and the tribal cultures became more and more fascinating and three dimensional. I learned that the ignorantly used term 'savages' was pitifully misplaced in most cases, and respresented simply gross misunderstanding of these cultures, and worse, the typically complete apathy often seen in trying to understand them. I think what I have always found most frustrating is that in degree, the same apathy still resides often in the studies of anthropology, ethnography and related subjects when it comes to the study of weapons that are often virtually icons of the cultures studied. This is primarily of course related to not only the paranoia of political correctness, but the unfortunate increase in violence that has steadily permeated the world. While many museums have put into storage valuable collections of weapons, and the topics of the importance of certain weapons culturally are often avoided in much published material, we here have sought to discover and preserve all we can of the histories of these weapons. We can only hope that better understanding of the importance of these weapons as important features of material culture rather than negative implements may bring them into the proper perspective. I would leave the details of the more specific aspects of your questions on the keris and magical connotations imbued in these weapons to the outstanding scholars on that subject who reside here, and we have the best!!! However I did want to address the broader scope of your excellent questions and would like to thank you for placing them here. I know that it has not only reminded me of, but reinforced why I am here, and very proud to be in the distinguished company of the membership of this forum. With very best regards, Jim Last edited by Jim McDougall; 16th March 2005 at 03:58 AM.