Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post - Talismanic Devices and Imbuements on Islamic Arms

Jim McDougall · 7th February 2019, 05:37 PM

Jens thank you for that great hilt entry!!! A perfect example of these unusual 'cintamani' combinations, and those 'lips' looking things do resemble clouds in a 'Rohrshach' kind of way.
Ibrahiim, thank you as well for the diligent research and entries here which are adding do much perspective to the topic.

It does seem that as with all kinds of symbolism or in many instances of intercultural exchange of influences, perception and semantics are going to have understandable differences.

For example, by way of analogy, the venerable European globe and cross, familiar as a key marking on German blades over several centuries, became a fixture not as a makers mark, but a kind of talismanic device which imbued protective properties as well as suggestion of high quality.

As these blades became traded into North Africa, the globe and cross was seen by natives in these regions as a drum and sticks, which were important in their culture as a status oriented symbol. Other markings which were often almost indeterminant in character were seen as (in one case) the fly, which odd as it sounds, to them represented the character of a great warrior.

There are many such examples and surely much the same in other cases where symbols and markings transcend cultural bounds.

I think obviously that the cintamani , referring to the three in figures usually dots, is much in this kind of situation which became a convention adopted broadly to represent what each group or culture perceived it to mean.

In many cases, of course such diffusion can lose deeper meanings and as applied in material culture items as decoration, becomes aesthetic in sense, but for our purposes we want to know the deeper meanings from their origins.

I once had a wonderful shamshir, which was clearly from Central Asia with an amazing instance of the three dot motif applied in linear fashion on the backstrap and other parts of the hilt. It was generally held that this use of the three dots represented the Turkic heritage of these people and of course heralding Tamerlane. In those times I could not associate this device (termed cintamani) with the 'gift giving jewel' in the usually described connotation. With this look into the deeper character of the term and its origins, it becomes much clearer.

So thank you Ibrahiim, and Jens, for adding all of this!!!

7th February 2019, 05:37 PM	#57
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,753	Jens thank you for that great hilt entry!!! A perfect example of these unusual 'cintamani' combinations, and those 'lips' looking things do resemble clouds in a 'Rohrshach' kind of way. Ibrahiim, thank you as well for the diligent research and entries here which are adding do much perspective to the topic. It does seem that as with all kinds of symbolism or in many instances of intercultural exchange of influences, perception and semantics are going to have understandable differences. For example, by way of analogy, the venerable European globe and cross, familiar as a key marking on German blades over several centuries, became a fixture not as a makers mark, but a kind of talismanic device which imbued protective properties as well as suggestion of high quality. As these blades became traded into North Africa, the globe and cross was seen by natives in these regions as a drum and sticks, which were important in their culture as a status oriented symbol. Other markings which were often almost indeterminant in character were seen as (in one case) the fly, which odd as it sounds, to them represented the character of a great warrior. There are many such examples and surely much the same in other cases where symbols and markings transcend cultural bounds. I think obviously that the cintamani , referring to the three in figures usually dots, is much in this kind of situation which became a convention adopted broadly to represent what each group or culture perceived it to mean. In many cases, of course such diffusion can lose deeper meanings and as applied in material culture items as decoration, becomes aesthetic in sense, but for our purposes we want to know the deeper meanings from their origins. I once had a wonderful shamshir, which was clearly from Central Asia with an amazing instance of the three dot motif applied in linear fashion on the backstrap and other parts of the hilt. It was generally held that this use of the three dots represented the Turkic heritage of these people and of course heralding Tamerlane. In those times I could not associate this device (termed cintamani) with the 'gift giving jewel' in the usually described connotation. With this look into the deeper character of the term and its origins, it becomes much clearer. So thank you Ibrahiim, and Jens, for adding all of this!!!