Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post - Re-hilted Bayonet?

Gonzalo G · 29th October 2008, 01:42 PM

Yes, I´ll do it

In Argentina was used the rifle Martini Henry with the bayonet named "Patent 1860", which had a recycled blade form older avant loaded or front charged models (I don´t recall the name of this kind of weapons). Even in latter replacements of this bayonet for the argentinean army, it was used a copy made by Alex Copel, who also made a replacement of the model named "Elcho".

But it seems to be a misunderstanding here. We are not talking about the blade of the bayonet, but about the facón made with this blade. It is not the same thing. The age of the blade only proofs that the facón was not made earlier, but not that the facón was made in the same era. The facones were made with DISCARDED bayonets, who were first used on the armies of Argentina, Brazil or Uruguay, usually models already discarded form european or USA armies when this Latin American countries recived them as new, and then when discarded in this countries, stored on the military warehouses for years, to be sold latter on wholesale, and latter in reatail by the new owners to the silversmiths and other specialist in mounting them.

So, the facones could be made with bayonets with several decades of age. Even today, very old bayonets are searched to make facones. Personally, I wouldn´t do it, as a bayonet is a piece of collection with it´s own merit, but the silversmiths can make a big deal on money mounting and selling them. It is their tradition.

Neverthless, I agree with Chris in one point: the main (but not exclusive, as on the Argentina´s northeast area it is still used as a weapon and a tool) use of the facón nowadays, is to show with the traditional dress. Sometimes also to show richness, as the best silver mounts could be very costly. And the best ones are mounted with the older and better blades available. We cannot criticize this practice, as here, the most searched swords are the most luxurious and ornamentated ones, showing the richness and power of the original owners.

You can see a discussion about the ACTUAL mounting of a bayonet-yataghan blade form the 19th Century, to make a facón, in this thread:

http://www.armasblancas.com.ar/foros...ble-curvo.html

I´m afraid the photos can only be seen with a previous registration.
Regards

Gonzalo

29th October 2008, 01:42 PM	#13
Gonzalo G Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Nothern Mexico Posts: 458	Yes, I´ll do it In Argentina was used the rifle Martini Henry with the bayonet named "Patent 1860", which had a recycled blade form older avant loaded or front charged models (I don´t recall the name of this kind of weapons). Even in latter replacements of this bayonet for the argentinean army, it was used a copy made by Alex Copel, who also made a replacement of the model named "Elcho". But it seems to be a misunderstanding here. We are not talking about the blade of the bayonet, but about the facón made with this blade. It is not the same thing. The age of the blade only proofs that the facón was not made earlier, but not that the facón was made in the same era. The facones were made with DISCARDED bayonets, who were first used on the armies of Argentina, Brazil or Uruguay, usually models already discarded form european or USA armies when this Latin American countries recived them as new, and then when discarded in this countries, stored on the military warehouses for years, to be sold latter on wholesale, and latter in reatail by the new owners to the silversmiths and other specialist in mounting them. So, the facones could be made with bayonets with several decades of age. Even today, very old bayonets are searched to make facones. Personally, I wouldn´t do it, as a bayonet is a piece of collection with it´s own merit, but the silversmiths can make a big deal on money mounting and selling them. It is their tradition. Neverthless, I agree with Chris in one point: the main (but not exclusive, as on the Argentina´s northeast area it is still used as a weapon and a tool) use of the facón nowadays, is to show with the traditional dress. Sometimes also to show richness, as the best silver mounts could be very costly. And the best ones are mounted with the older and better blades available. We cannot criticize this practice, as here, the most searched swords are the most luxurious and ornamentated ones, showing the richness and power of the original owners. You can see a discussion about the ACTUAL mounting of a bayonet-yataghan blade form the 19th Century, to make a facón, in this thread: http://www.armasblancas.com.ar/foros...ble-curvo.html I´m afraid the photos can only be seen with a previous registration. Regards Gonzalo Last edited by Gonzalo G; 29th October 2008 at 02:20 PM.