Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post - I'd Like to Learn More About This Madura Keris

A. G. Maisey · 24th January 2022, 08:55 PM

I cannot see a Kul Buntet David, I can see what I think are probably artefacts from the creation of the twist pamor.

Charles, this is a reasonably common pamor in Madura blades, both older ones and certainly Kamardikan. Regrettably, this example is not particularly well controlled.

From the photos I am not able to be certain about age:- this type of pamor & blade quality is quite prevalent in Madura Kamardikan keris, but this blade looks as if it might be older, however, the gonjo is a poor fit to the blade, and I would not expect this sloppy fit in a blade with virtually no erosion. I would need to handle this keris to be at all certain about probable age.

The dress is old, late Colonial Period, and nice, but the dress was not made for this keris, it is a refit.

Regarding the similarity of Madura & Javanese twist pattern pamors to Moro twist pattern pamors. In previous times pande keris & empus from Madura travelled all over SE Asia. They worked in Sumatra, the Peninsula, Borneo, Brunei, and the Philippines.

Madura is now and always has been a place where it is difficult to make a living, many people get out of Madura as soon as they can. In East Jawa, Malang, Jember, every little town & village you will find people from Madura. Many Madurese live in Surabaya and along the North Coast.

I have a very slim Moro style keris that was probably the state execution keris of Brunei, it dates from 1862. A number of Javanese ahli keris in Solo, Central Jawa handled this keris in the 1990's and all were of the opinion that it was Madura work.

The terminology "twist core" is one that when applied to Madura and Javanese keris is patently incorrect. When applied to Moro keris it a term that has always caused me to doubt its accuracy.

For any blade to be "twist core", the core must be made first, then the cutting edge must be inserted into the core. This is the way that the Merovingian blades & other old European blades were made. It was a necessary process used to clean the poor quality material that these societies used. It became a mark of quality, and buyers began to demand that "twist core" appearance even after good quality material became available, and the earlier cleaning process was no longer necessary.

But the vast majority of Indonesian keris blades are not made by creating a pamor core and then inserting the cutting edge. With Indonesian blades the pamor is a plate that is forge welded to both sides of the steel core.

I suspect that if we put a saw through a few "twist core" Moro blades we might find a method of construction that is similar to the Indonesian method.

24th January 2022, 08:55 PM	#4
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,700	I cannot see a Kul Buntet David, I can see what I think are probably artefacts from the creation of the twist pamor. Charles, this is a reasonably common pamor in Madura blades, both older ones and certainly Kamardikan. Regrettably, this example is not particularly well controlled. From the photos I am not able to be certain about age:- this type of pamor & blade quality is quite prevalent in Madura Kamardikan keris, but this blade looks as if it might be older, however, the gonjo is a poor fit to the blade, and I would not expect this sloppy fit in a blade with virtually no erosion. I would need to handle this keris to be at all certain about probable age. The dress is old, late Colonial Period, and nice, but the dress was not made for this keris, it is a refit. Regarding the similarity of Madura & Javanese twist pattern pamors to Moro twist pattern pamors. In previous times pande keris & empus from Madura travelled all over SE Asia. They worked in Sumatra, the Peninsula, Borneo, Brunei, and the Philippines. Madura is now and always has been a place where it is difficult to make a living, many people get out of Madura as soon as they can. In East Jawa, Malang, Jember, every little town & village you will find people from Madura. Many Madurese live in Surabaya and along the North Coast. I have a very slim Moro style keris that was probably the state execution keris of Brunei, it dates from 1862. A number of Javanese ahli keris in Solo, Central Jawa handled this keris in the 1990's and all were of the opinion that it was Madura work. The terminology "twist core" is one that when applied to Madura and Javanese keris is patently incorrect. When applied to Moro keris it a term that has always caused me to doubt its accuracy. For any blade to be "twist core", the core must be made first, then the cutting edge must be inserted into the core. This is the way that the Merovingian blades & other old European blades were made. It was a necessary process used to clean the poor quality material that these societies used. It became a mark of quality, and buyers began to demand that "twist core" appearance even after good quality material became available, and the earlier cleaning process was no longer necessary. But the vast majority of Indonesian keris blades are not made by creating a pamor core and then inserting the cutting edge. With Indonesian blades the pamor is a plate that is forge welded to both sides of the steel core. I suspect that if we put a saw through a few "twist core" Moro blades we might find a method of construction that is similar to the Indonesian method.