Thread: hilt material ?
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Old 8th January 2010, 02:06 AM   #73
A. G. Maisey
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 5,034

Thank you Guwaya for your comprehensive response to my post.

Yes, I did misunderstand your "hanging the ladder to high", I interpreted this in the sense of the well known expression "setting the bar too high". I have nothing but extreme respect for the gentleman behind Achim Weihrauch, and I most certainly would never knowingly, nor willingly compromise him.

As to obtaining accurate, factual or truthful answers within the context of Javanese society.
Yes, I am completely familiar with Javanese practice in this regard, on all levels.

"Mau kemana Pak?"

"Kantor pos 'Bu"

langsung ke pasar.

It is not expected, nor to be expected, that truthful answers will be given to any question. We need to feel the truth, not try to encapsulate it in words, moreover, gratuitous truths are held to be extremely ill mannered. This Javanese idea of the concept of "truth" is probably the principal reason why so many relationships, both business and personal, fail between Javanese people and people from a western culture. The answer given to a direct question is very often the answer that the person who has been asked believes that the asker wishes to receive. This is especially true when dealing with foriegners.

Thus, in matters of keris research, perhaps the only way a foriegner will get straight answers is if that foriegner is adopted as family by somebody who is able to teach him. As long as he remains outside Javanese family society, he will forever be an outsider with the consequent need to be treated with caution.

Thank you clarifying the matter of Achim Weihrauch's present location.

Regretably I cannot read German, so I will never be able to judge for myself the extent of the excellence of Achim Weihrauch's work. I thank you for your opinion in this regard.


Thank you for your further comments.

We all form our opinions upon the basis of our own experience. I do not ever wish to force my opinions upon another.

My experience with museums and other "experts" is that very often they are guessing or relying upon things such as provenance when they affix ages to things such as keris.

Since keris hilt patterns from several hundred years ago are still being carved today, and were also carved in the recent past, the only indicators we have of age, apart from provenance , is wear and patina, then age becomes an informed guess based on experience.

Speaking for myself, I know of no way other than what I have just written that will give any indication of the age of a keris hilt.

Re the sun.

I eagerly await further information on this motif.
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