Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post

Jim McDougall · 27th June 2007, 02:42 PM

Hi Olikara,
That is an excellent question!!! and in all honesty seems like the type of question that should be asked when studying the features in hilt forms, but in the years I have pursued this, nobody has ever noted it including me

On military swords, they typically follow a pattern which has a basic design and often with very subtle variations or features that seemed to have a degree of consistancy with individual makers who contracted to the govt.
The British M1796 light cavalry sabre for other ranks was one of the first truly 'regulation' patterns for them, and while these sabres were inclined to almost monotonous sameness, the officers had considerable latitude in ordering thier own custom swords.

The M1796 hilts were typically of forged iron, with other ranks being of course standard, and although officers sabres were as described, often custom made, they too were typically forged iron and followed the guidelines in so called 'stirrup hilt' with 'birds head' type pommel (meaning a smooth rounded pommel which smoothly carried down through the backstrap.
As Kronckew has noted, that 90 degree turn at the bottom of the knucklebow would most definitely be weakened, and though I am far from any expertise in metalwork or metallurgy, it seems a reinforcement would be the most likely explanation.

When casting brass hilts, I am not sure if there are similar dynamics as I believe the forged metal is worked, while the cast is not. In the case of the brass hilts, they were cast from a mold, which may have been from the original hilt form itself in this instance. The feature, though originally structural in the original, would carry through in the finished product .

I think Krockews very astute observation on these being positioning guides for a sword knot is also well placed, and again an idea I had not thought of. On the original M1796 sabres, there were usually slots on the knuckleguard for these knots, with the purpose he had described, however I have seen more decorative M1796 sabres with knots placed as he has noted.

All the best,
Jim

27th June 2007, 02:42 PM	#9
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,194	Hi Olikara, That is an excellent question!!! and in all honesty seems like the type of question that should be asked when studying the features in hilt forms, but in the years I have pursued this, nobody has ever noted it including me On military swords, they typically follow a pattern which has a basic design and often with very subtle variations or features that seemed to have a degree of consistancy with individual makers who contracted to the govt. The British M1796 light cavalry sabre for other ranks was one of the first truly 'regulation' patterns for them, and while these sabres were inclined to almost monotonous sameness, the officers had considerable latitude in ordering thier own custom swords. The M1796 hilts were typically of forged iron, with other ranks being of course standard, and although officers sabres were as described, often custom made, they too were typically forged iron and followed the guidelines in so called 'stirrup hilt' with 'birds head' type pommel (meaning a smooth rounded pommel which smoothly carried down through the backstrap. As Kronckew has noted, that 90 degree turn at the bottom of the knucklebow would most definitely be weakened, and though I am far from any expertise in metalwork or metallurgy, it seems a reinforcement would be the most likely explanation. When casting brass hilts, I am not sure if there are similar dynamics as I believe the forged metal is worked, while the cast is not. In the case of the brass hilts, they were cast from a mold, which may have been from the original hilt form itself in this instance. The feature, though originally structural in the original, would carry through in the finished product . I think Krockews very astute observation on these being positioning guides for a sword knot is also well placed, and again an idea I had not thought of. On the original M1796 sabres, there were usually slots on the knuckleguard for these knots, with the purpose he had described, however I have seen more decorative M1796 sabres with knots placed as he has noted. All the best, Jim