Thank you Gavin, I believe I now understand much that previously was not clear to me.  
 
Malaysian sources? 
 
We are using very different understandings & value systems, when this happens it is a bit like a Frenchman, thinking & speaking in French, conversing about Turkey with somebody from Hong Kong who is thinking & speaking in Cantonese. 
 
I probably have nothing of value to contribute further.
		 
		
		
		
		
		
		
		
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