Ethnographic Arms & Armour

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-   -   Mid to Late 16th Century Patrons for Paper Cartridges (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=8540)

Matchlock 24th March 2012 03:35 PM

Top Quality Patrons, Etched and Inlaid With Bone
 
10 Attachment(s)
... for officers of the Trabanten-Leibgarde (bodyguards) of the Electors of Saxony, ca. 1580.
As you may have noticed on one on the samples in my collection, all Saxon patrons open by a shift button on the underside while Nuremberg or Ausgburg productions open by a push button on the front.

Photos taken by the author in the collection of famous Burg Eltz.

m

Matchlock 25th March 2012 05:23 PM

8 Attachment(s)
For comparison with the items in the previous post, I repost my fine Suhl made Saxon patron of ca. 1580, which features the same shifting knob opening mechanism installed in the bottom mount.

m

Matchlock 26th March 2012 02:09 PM

12 Attachment(s)
Another etched Saxon patron, identically equal to my sample posted in the previous thread in both form and workmanship, apart from the etching and the fact that the wooden body of my piece is not stamped in imitation of natural staghorn but leather covered.
This one is dated 1587 and numbered 'NUMERI 23', for guardsman #23.

Best,
m

Matchlock 26th March 2012 02:18 PM

8 Attachment(s)
The remaining images.

m

Matchlock 26th March 2012 02:53 PM

6 Attachment(s)
This beautiful etched patron of earliest type, datable to ca. 1550-60 on the grounds of the style of its etching, its formal criteria and the fact that instead of the usual loops for leather strings found on other patrons, this one features a straight belt hook which is punched with the Gothic trefoil decoration.
It was sold Christie's, 12 December 2006.

I posted it here before but now I found almost his pair in the Saxon Electoral Armories in Dresden (attached). Thus both can be attrributed to the guard of the Elector August of Saxony.

It is also comparable to the etched and gilt patron dated 1559 in the Musée de l'Armée in Paris, see post #14.

The last attachment shows the belt hook of a powder flask dated 1552, originally belonging to Pfalzgraf Ottheinrich; its belt hook is very similar in both shape and decoration.

m

Piotr M. Zalewski 4th February 2013 06:29 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Dear Colleagues!
I am a restorator of antiques in National Museum in Warsaw, I specialize in metal objects and miscellaneous materials, but beside of this, I work to prepare to doctorate in art and military technique. My subject is about origin of Polish cavalry cartridge box (pouche). It means that I am looking for objects similar to, for example Lancer cartage box from Napoleon period, but from XVIIth or even XVIth century, Of course I know that it was in use others pouches & webbing patterns to carry ammunition, but I am very poor in this information. I have got all information about objects from Polish’s museums but it is not enough. In hope to find more information. Do you know anything about cartridge boxes from XVIIth century similar to these I present on my photos?
Looking forward for reply,
mgr Piotr M. Zalewski
Muzeum Narodowe w Warszawie
On phothos you can see my copy (as a matter of fact it is reconstruction ) of polish National Cavalry cartige box for "Towarzysz" (nobil man in service as a private in cavalry) in use 1786-1791.

fernando 4th February 2013 06:54 PM

Welcome to the forum Piotr,
I hope you find some answers to your question; surely if there are members familiar with this subject, they will soon post their comments :cool: .

Piotr M. Zalewski 4th February 2013 07:08 PM

Thank you for invitation!
I have forgot to write, that on phothos you can see my copy(as a matter of fact it is reconstruction) of polish National Cavalry cartige box for "Towarzysz" (nobil-private) from 1786-1791.
Piotr M. Zalewski

fernando 5th February 2013 12:28 PM

Great work :cool:

M ELEY 6th February 2013 02:16 PM

Welcome to the Forum, Piotr! Always good to have an expert in their field posting here!

Matchlock 19th March 2014 12:01 PM

2 Attachment(s)
This the shape of a typical High Gothic quiver for quarrels/crossbow bolts; its basic form with the straight sides strongly influenced the earliest trapezoid powder flasks and, for the complete short span of time of their production, which was only from ca. 1550-1590, the rare patrons for paper cartridges.

First quiver in the Bavarian Army Museum Ingolstadt, the second, with the concavely curved sides, in a private collection.
Author's photoographs.


m

Matchlock 19th March 2014 06:37 PM

8 Attachment(s)
For an extremely fine, early (ca. 1550) and highly unusual patron combining various functions both technical and mechanical in one single device, please see

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=15278

m

Matchlock 24th May 2014 04:15 PM

Please also see my threads on wheellock spanners 1520-1650:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showt...l-lock+spanners


http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showt...l-lock+spanners

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showt...ellock+spanners

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showt...el-lock+spanner


Best,
Michael

Piotr M. Zalewski 24th June 2014 08:55 PM

Dear Matchlock!
I admire your knowlage so may be you will know anything about such objects, I have seen in Viena Arsenal Museum. I had asked them, but they said me that this cartridge pouches (which for me looks as polish onces) are withougt history. About sabre with cartridge I had know that it is from Grace Museum.
Can you help? As I had written you in private mesage I am writting a doctorate work about origin of "polish cartridge pouch" so any information I need is very important for me.
Looking forward....
With best regards...
Piotr M. Zalewski

Matchlock 24th June 2014 10:20 PM

7 Attachment(s)
Dear Piotr,


Thank you so much for your kind words, they made me blush!

Let's get serious though: actually, admiration is not at all what I deserve. Having dedicated more than 35 years of my life solely to the studies of a section of historical weaponry almost completely neglected so far, I feel obliged to be able and clarify with authority literally any question, as well as produce actual samples to back up my statement.
If it were not so I would have to regard myself as a flash in the pan -to abide by the matchlock image (I do like this pun :eek::cool: ).

Concerning your query, I leafed through my 280,000+ analog photo archives for hours until I finally managed to come up with the samples attached. I took them at the Graz Armory (Landeszeughaus) in Styria, Southern Austria, and at the Heeresgeschichtliches Museum (Army Museum) in Vienna.
Depicted are so-called Fuhrmann-Dusäggen (carters' tessaks), ca. 1580-90, meaning Austria manufactured sabers the scabbards of which are combined with a patron. The latter consists of a core of
tin-plated sheet divided in an average of 5 soldered cylindrical compartments for paper cartridges. This tinned iron patron was covered with thin leather and formed an integral part of the scabbard locket (German: Mundblech).

For today, and to make your mouth water, I attached a few photos of Styrian Dusäggen in the Graz Armory..
Of course, I will digitalize and post more soon.


Best,
Michael

Piotr M. Zalewski 25th June 2014 09:00 PM

Dear Matchlock,
Thank you for information. Could you tell me what type of firearms they use?
Piotr M. Zalewski

Matchlock 27th June 2014 09:35 AM

9 Attachment(s)
Dear Piotr,


Be patient! ;)
And please call me Michael.

I will add a lot more photos, and of course I will try and find out about the guns that originally belonged to these sabres, the scabbard/sheath of each fitted with a cartridge bag each. Both the sabers and the firearms formed the armament of the Styrian carters from about 1560-90.
The leather cartridge bag of the scabbard of each saber held a tinned iron tinned-iron cartridge container consisting of five caliber-size tubes soldered together.

The Michael Trömner Collection holds such an original cartridge bag retaining its tinned-iron cartridge box, and all preserved in fine, virtually ‘untouched’ condition for some 440 years. The inner width of each small tube is 14 mm, corresponding to .55 caliber. In the late 16th century, this was regarded as rather ‘small bore’ whereas it was the most common inner diameter of the barrels of both matchlock and wheellock arquebuses from ca. 1500-1560. My sample still even holds considerable traces of black powder as fine as meal powder – and an original paper cartridge! According to my experiences, black powder from that period will not even burn any more, let alone explode.As black powder was not grained yet in those days, the three components – sulphur, saltpeter and charcoal – have demixed long since and got moist over the centuries. See attachments in the following post.

I remember purchasing that bag from the German dealer Dieter Schempp, at an antique weapons show in Stuttgart in the early 1990's. At 980 Deutsche Mark/490 euros, it was all but cheap for such a small object; I was aware, though, of the fact that that little piece was an extreme rarity and purchased it right away.
It was to turn out that I acted right for I have never come across the like of it ever since. That guy Schempp, who lived near the Bodensee, often sold objects that came from the Graz armory; as I was the one collector he usually offered these things first I acquired most of my Graz related pieces of accouterment from him, and for more than 30 years.

The fact is known among old and skilled collectors that in the 1970’s and 1980’s, a member of the staff of the Graz Landeszeughaus took lots of items – all not documented and photographed at that time – from the reserve collection/depot rooms and sold them, right after closing time of the Graz museum, to a tiny group of three or four Austrian collectors who regularly met at a nearby Gasthaus. A great collector, and long-time friend of mine who lived in Linz/Austria, told me all about it, he, too, acquired a lot of items that way. Sadly he died a few weeks ago. Of course, all those objects were sold for a song, like a supper and a few pints of beer.
Apart from that, the Graz armory/Joanneum officially sold hundreds of pieces of all kinds of weapons, armor and accouterments on various occasions; they also still trade in pieces from the Landeszeughaus/Joanneum depots when collectors offer them an item they are interested in but cannot buy it.
My friend Armin König and I eye-witnessed that fact in September 2005 when the Graz curators Dr. Muchitsch and Dr. Toifl were willing to trade in many objects, among them a short cast-bronze Late Gothic handgonne. I still keep their emails inviting us and stating their willingness to trade and swap items from their collections.

That is a story of its own, though; so let us get back to those cartridge bags.
I do not know if Graz holds any records identifying the sort of guns the Styrian carters employed but they must have been short wheellock arquebuses. Attached find images of such a wheellock arquebus, ca. 1580-90, and preserved at the Graz armory.

Enjoy the photos, as they depict details which hardly anybody has ever been given the chance to detect - or has cared to before I started doing research in such far-out things. Thanks to internet publishing, now we can study each and every little detail magnified and zoomed up to a multiple of its actual size! This quality just cannot be matched by any kind of traditional print media, not matter what book, journal article or catalog!


Best,
Michael Trömner

Matchlock 27th June 2014 08:16 PM

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Here is a Nuremberg manufactured wheellock arquebus of the 1580's to ca. 1590.
It should be considered as the characteristic type of short wheellock gun that would seem ideal for Styrian carters, together with their sabers; its caliber of 13.6 mm excactly fits the inner diameter (14 mm) of the cartridge containers wrought integrally with the scabbards.
The saddle ring mounted opposite of the lock denotes that it was employed by a horseman, probably one of the armed riders escorting the carts.
Landeszeughaus Graz, inv.no. RG 10.
Scans from:
Robert Brooker: Radschloss Sammlung (sic!) - Wheellock Collection. Landeszeughaus Graz, Austria, 2007, p.319.


The long iron finial of the wooden ramrod threaded for a worm or scourer is an early feature that, in some instances, was tradionally kept until the end of the 16th century; it emerges first in about 1530 when wooden ramrods were often fitted with iron finals to both ends.
A very fine, long (1.63 m overall) and elegantly designed sniper's wheellock musket of ca. 1590, in the Italian manner but obviously made at an Augsburg workshop, and preserved in almost mint condition, is in
The Michael Trömner Collection and will be introduced in a thread of its own.
Attached at the bottom are three images which I took in my collection on 19 June 2014.

This extraordinary and outstanding musket comes from the amory at
the Fortress Hohensalzburg from where it
was deaccessioned illegally (to say the least), together with literally thousands of all kinds of weapons, by the museum's director Dr. Albin Rohrmoser, in 1986-89. Right on dectection, he shot himself. Nevertheless the Salzburg museum Carolino Augusteum was scandalized because some people know the facts, and my analog photos are documents.

I photographed the reserve collection just a few days before its disposal; there was literally heaps of guns and long pikes all of which, so I was told by a staff member, got readied to be collected by some dealers the next day.
Dieter Mayer, who lives in Neuötting, Bavaria, eyewitnessed everything I am telling.

Attached to the following post find two photos I took - two, out of 200+ ...
I definitely know the people involved. For years thereafter, sheer masses of Salzburg arsenal arms and accouterments kept floating the market, including international sales houses like
Christie's London, Galerie Fischer Lucerne and Hermann Historica Munich, e.g.

- some 60 combined wheellock and matchlock muskets, Suhl, ca. 1665-70, their butt stocks all drilled! for crude attachment to the wall by long screws, all done in the early 20th century; when I attended the
Carolino Augusteum in Salzburg first on 8 November 1987,
on the walls of the aisle to the bureaus of the museum staff I noticed old b/w photos depicting the early 20th c. display - with a long row of those muskets screwed to the walls!
One of them has been in The Michael Trömner Collection since April 1988, when I bought it from Franz Christof in Greding, Bavaria; both he and Georg Britsch had acquired hundreds of firearms deaccessioned from Salzburg only weeks ago from another dealer, Werner Mewes, Ulm:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=14071&highlight=combined+wheellock+matchlock


- mid-16th century long pikes, the iron heads retaining almost all their original bluing!, and mounted on their original ash wood hafts (original length ca. 6 meters, and cut down to
4.60-4.80 meters in the 1st haf of the 17th century; I purchased my two fine specimens at Christie's sale on 19 September 1990, lots 47 and 48, and they have been in The Michael Trömner Collection ever since:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=7123&highlight=pikes+christie%27s

- musket rests with their original fir wood hafts painted red, the iron forks and pointed shoes both preserving either their original case-hardened or blackended finish, and still retaining their Salzburg inventory brass tags
Also attached to the following post are three photos of a Thirty Years War musket rest which I took in the Salzburg depot at the Fortress Hohenwerfen on 8 Nov 1988 - only 2 months before I was offered, and bought, that very same item doubtlessly identifiable by its brass inventory tag!


- finely decorated Nuremberg manufactured patrons/cartridge boxes from the very same series delivered to the Graz armory in 1577-78. I won my sample at Christie's sale of
The Eugen Nielsen Collection, 31 March 1993, lot 176; it represents the top quality officers version adorned with dozens of tiny brass studs all shaped like strars. The Graz armory holds the only other two samples I have ever come across, inv.nos. PK 15 and PK 18; cf. Brooker, p. 625 - cf. previous post, and my posts #1 and 10 - right above in the thread you are reading at this moment:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=8540&highlight=patrons+cartridge+boxes+nuremberg


Although some stylistic features of the Graz arquebus in discussion can be found with guns dating from ca. 1570 in general the author is convinced that this Styrian arsenal specimen should not be dated any earlier than ca 1580.
Its latest feature is definitely the bridle (German: Studel) bridging the arms of the dog spring as well as the leaf spring of the safety catch, and securing both of them to two screws simultaneously.

The earliest known wheellock featuring an external bridle to the dog spring is an unusually long combined wheellock and snap-tinderlock musket of ca. 1570, the bridle! to the spring of the tinder holder dated 1574.
According to the Schloss Dyck inventory, that fine and most likely Nuremberg manufactured gun measured 2.45 m overall.
Cf. Max v. Ehrenthal: Die Waffensammlung des Fürsten Salm-Reifferscheidt zu Schloss Dyck, Leipzig, 1906, no.111, p.18.

That piece was probably a paramilitary sniper's gun, its barrel providing long range performance by its length of 211 cm. It was sold Christie's London, as part of the whole Armory of Their Serene Highnesses the Princes von Salm-Reifferscheidt at Schloss Dyck: Part II, 23 Sept. 1992, lot 388.
See attachments to this post
.

The bridle to the dog spring of that musket may be considered to be an original Nuremberg technical innovation of the early 1570's, and as an amendment added to this specimen in 1574. This would also account for the unprecedented fact of dating such a tiny part as a bridle.
According to his more than 35 years of research studies, the author defines the long tubular slotted rear sight called 'unusual' in the catalog description, to form - together with the triangular bone inlays of the stock - another stylistic and technical criterion for limiting the time line of dating this gun to ca. 1555-1575, which would generally mean 'ca. 1565-70'.
The long tubular rear sight originated in the 1550's. As the gun combines both traditional and most current elements for post-1570, the date 1574 struck on the bridle definitely marks the year of manufacturing.

The decisive fundamental principle for correctly dating any item, defined first by the author is the most recent/latest stylistic, formal and technical feature found on any object.
Working life alterations and adaptions basically have to be considered of course, and are especially typical of arsenal arms that were kept in working order, and ready to be used in case of an emergency over centuries.
E.g., in the former arsenal at the Fortress Hohenwerfen near Salzburg, Austria, sold at auction in New York in 1927, there were a few Late Gothic haquebut barrels dating from ca. 1490-1500, the stocks probably 16th to 17th century, and transformed to percussion in the mid-19th century!
Cf. sales catalog The Great Historical Collection of Arms & Armour: the Entire Contents of the Armoury, Fortress Hohenwerfen near Salzburg, Austria; Inherited & Augmented by H.I.&R.H. Archduke Eugen, F.M. Anderson Galleries, N.Y., 22nd February through 5th March 1927, lots 583 and 584, p.94;
these two lots sold again, with one of them illustrated:
Sotheby's N.Y., 1 June 1991, lot 420.
Original copies of both catalogs in the author's 3,000+ volume library.



Best,
Michael Trömner

Matchlock 28th June 2014 07:02 AM

Attachments:

- ... close-ups of my long and higly elegant marksman's wheellock musket, Augsburg, in the Italian manner, ca. 1590; note that the original ash wood ramrod is fitted with an iron finial to either end: the one at the fore end reflecting the bulbous style of the muzzle section whereas the longer, rearward finial is internally threaded for a worm or scourer:



- two photos I took of a heap of long guns and pikes at the arms depot of the Fortress Hohensalzburg, Salzburg, Austria, all ready to be deaccessioned; 8 Nov 1987

- three photos of a Thirty Years War musket rest, the fir wood haft characteristically painted red, and with the iron parts retaining all of their original blackened finish; together with many similar specimens, it was removed retaining its Salzburg brass inventory tag shortly after I photographed it on 8 Nov 1987


m

Matchlock 28th June 2014 07:35 PM

.

fernando 2nd July 2014 07:00 PM

MISSING PICTURES IN POST #45
 
2 Attachment(s)
The following pictures should have been uploaded in post #45 but, for some reason, Piotr couldn't manage to do it.
Please consider them por your comments, as he kindly requests.

.

Matchlock 2nd July 2014 08:46 PM

12 Attachment(s)
Hi Nando and Piotr,


These images undoubtedly depict a load or patron/paper cartridge belt (German: Ladungs- oder Papierpatronen-Gurt) comprising a patron/cartridge bag, with a wooden core
drilled for ten paper cartridges covered with ooze or chamois leather (German: lohgares oder Sämischleder), and curved to fit the waist.
This is an extremely rare instance of ammunition related accouterment for Austrian and German musketeers and calivermen, ca. mid to late 17th century/post-Thirty Years War (1618-48), which has not been noted by historic weaponry before today.
Actually, the author signing this post is the first researcher to ever define, and herewith publish, this piece of accouterments.

The images in the previous posts, obviously copyrighted by Piotr :cool:;) - thanks a lot Piotr: you sure did a GREAT JOB! - , and posted by Nando ;) - thanks as well Nando, my friend! - , were taken in the exhibition rooms of the Heeresgeschichtliches Museum (Army museum) Wien/Vienna, Austria.

Attached to this post and the following, find photos of the very same items, taken by the author in the show rooms of the same Vienna museum, and by special appointment, on 12 July 1990.
Besides a leather hat for a musketeer, the attachments also include
some singular and original ... century Austrian test fabric samples of raw linnen which the soldiers standardized garments were made of - all of them perfectly documented by enlarged copies of excerpts from the original archived documents on these fabric samples.

The next in line attachments introduce
another very rare sample of a late 17th c. German or Austrian load or cartridge waist belt, the wooden core drilled for 20! paper cartridges, and the outside of the bag's leather blind-tooled with a lozenge pattern (German: blindgeprägtes Leder); German private collection:
- 2 attachments


and some fine ca. 1680-1700 Dutch/North Western Germany type of patron/cartridge bags;
author's photographs of 6 June 1987 taken in the exhibition rooms at the Emden
Rüstkammer (The Emden historic armory) in Ostfriesland:
- 2 attachments

Those patron/cartridge bags were most probably used along with one of the latest types of matchlock or wheellock muskets, including combined versions of these igniting systems.

For the latter type of 17th century 'high tech' infantry long guns/muskets please cf.
a fine ca. 1665-70 Suhl made Austrian combined wheellock and matchlock musket
in The Michael Trömner Collection
, coming straight from the former reserve collection/depot of the Fortress Hohensalzburg, mainly via the dealer Werner Mewes, Ulm/Germany; also involved were Georg Britsch sen. and Franz Christof, and together with many other amost identical muskets all representing the very same model manfuctured in Suhl/Thuringia and delivered to German, Austrina and Swiss arsenals:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showt...+Suhl+Austri a

As I stated in post #49 above, literally thousands of weapons of all sorts were illegaly 'deaccessioned' from the reserve collection/depot located on the Fortress Hohensalzburg/Austria in 1987-9.


Those patron/cartridge bags in discussion may have been used together with early type combined flintlock and matchlock infantry muskets of ca. 1670-80 as well, though.

Attached are author's photos
of caracteristic samples preserved in the Graz Landeszeughaus (Styrian arsenal); these photographs were taken on 9 July 1987 and 3 September 1990.
- 1 image attached at the bottom of this post, illustrating the Graz museum arrangement of wheellock pistols, scabbards and patrons/cartridge boxes.


For all other attachments please see my following posts.



Alas, this group of 1680's Suhl manufactured muskets is incorrectly termed, and defined as belonging to the almost mythic MONTECUCCOLI system - by the present Graz museum staff.
I have sufficient proof to state that the Graz curators succeeding in office to
Dr. Peter Krenn, all have neglected the obvious fact that all the combined flintlock and matchlock Suhl muskets in both the arsenal collections of the Graz Landeszeughaus and the Vienna Heeresgeschichtliches Museum are actually far from deserving to be termed as 'MONTECUCCOLI' muskets
...


As the author has stated various times, The Michael Trömner Collection is the only collection known to hold a true sample of the legendary M 1666 MONTECUCCOLI type, coming straight from the arsenal of The Counts von Stauffenberg, and preserved in optimum original condition overall.
I won it phone bidding at SOTHEBY's London sale of 10 July 2002, lot 242 - cf. my thread:

1666: The MONTECUCCOLI musket - a MYTH Verified!
And Common Type Combined Flintlock and Matchlock Suhl Made Muskets, 1680's:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showt...2119#post172119

The only other type of military type contemporary with these patron/cartridge bags are
earliest Germanic/Suhl manufactured types of flintlock infantry muskets of ca. 1700-20.
- Attached are images I took of such guns preserved in the
Graz Landeszeughaus (Styrian arsenal).


Best,
Michael/Michl
Michael Trömner


Matchlock 3rd July 2014 07:05 PM

..

Matchlock 3rd July 2014 07:06 PM

...

Matchlock 3rd July 2014 07:54 PM

,

Piotr M. Zalewski 16th August 2014 07:23 PM

5 Attachment(s)
Theory and a short history of the POLISH CARTRIDGE BOX ( ŁADOWNICA POLSKA)

A Polish cartridge box (ładownica Polska) is a type a box made of wood
and metal, covered by material or leather with an arm belt and a
leather or a material lid with an added metal plate. It is similar to
cartridge boxes used by XVIII/XIX cavalry.
As that I know, it appeared at the end of XVI century or at the
beginning of XVII century during Polish Ottoman war at the Polish
territories, that constitute present-day Ukraine. Turkey and their
allied Crimean Tartars constantly attacked Polish borders. There were
also similar incursions from Moscow and Moldova. Polish army of the
period consisted of a small, albeit a well trained infantry and
artillery as well as more numerous cavalry. Due to a mobile nature, the
cavalry constituted a primary and most efficient arm at the vast and
empty territories of Ukraine.
During XVI century, conquest of the neighbouring territories was a
primary object of the West-European wars (seizure of castles/towns
etc). In case of the Kingdom of Poland, protection of the vast
territories against enemy invasion was most important. There was plenty
of land for everyone, and there was no need for territorial expansion.
The Kingdom needed peace. Therefore physical elimination of the enemy
forces constituted a main task of the Polish army and its commanders .
It is not well known that there were a lot of firearms during the
period. Polish units protecting the border, by standards of the day,
had a considerable firepower. A standard tactic, was to move quickly,
attack with sabres and lances, defend on foot with fire arms. Since the
wagons would slow-down the movement, the army moved with personal
equipment and ammunition. Therefore Polish Cartridge boxes carried 10
to 20 and more cartridges each.
A paper cartridge was well known in XVI century. For example during
battle at Byczyna (24.01.1588) between Polish and Austrian forces,
commanded respectively by Jan Zamoyskiand Maxymilian III Habsburg (a
pretender to Polish Crown), Polish army capture a lot of ammunition
cartridges. There were black-powder manufactures spread all over
Kingdom (sulphur i saltpetre was on place). There were also numerous paper
manufactures in southern Poland (paper from Poland was exported to
Hungary, Moscow). In effect there was a significant supply of a
“second class” paper. So called “gray paper” or “packing paper”. There
were also a good supply of a higher quality paper from printing
offices (during Reformation and Contr Reformation different Churches
printed a lot of books and other publications). Leftovers from the
printing process were used to produce cartridges.
There is a confirmed information about a Polish cartridge box in
diaries from the period of a Polish occupation of Kremlin in Moscow
from 1612. Next there is a cartridge box listed in a document produced
after death of a craftsman in 1618. There are also municipal tax
regulations dated 1626 in Lublin which provides information on prices
and description of different types of Polish cartridge boxes –Ładownica.
There is also a numerous iconography presenting Polish cartridge boxes
from the period: at the tomb of Hetman (i.e. general) Żółkiewski in Żółkiew (present day Ukraine) dated: after 1621- before 1635,


Another in Tarłowo church (ca 1645-50).
In both bas-reliefs there is an earlier and a simple type of Ładownica – with short cover and without metal plate on front.

Next, there are objects from Beresteczko (28.06-10.07.1651)
battlefield, where Polish army defeated Cossack rebels. During the
second half of XVII century Ładownica, which was originally a simple,
rough and ordinary utility object, became and expensive, part of an
army equipment, which confirmed material status of the owner. The
process started during the rule of the King Jan III Sobieski and Viena
Victory in 1683. The fact that there is a few luxury objects dated end
of XVII century (e.g. in Swedisch collection of the goods stolen
during the Swedish invasion / so called “Potop Szwedzki” or a Swedish
deluge) there are no objects such as Ładownica confirms low value of
such objects during the period. In comparison Ładownice (cartidge
boxes) from end of XVII and beginning of XVIII c. were decorated in the
same style as sabres of the Polish nobles (a mix of western barocco
style and the eastern splendour).

In western Europe this type of cartridge box appeared after 30-Years
War, when Polish light-horse cavalry (so called Lisowczycy) served in
the Habsburg army, in German states, Hungary and even France. I
believe that they exported the invention.
Till know knowledge about origin of such part of webbing as Cartridge
box was very limited. There is no sufficient Polish literature on the
subject. There are only 4 articles including mine. Prof. Zdzisław
Żygulski jun. published the most important book about arms and armour
in Poland in 1982. The book says that a paper cartridge was invented
in Spain at the end of XVI century and that King of Sweden, Gustavus
Adolphus introduced cartridge to the army service. I repeated this
information in my first text on the origin of cartridge boxes of
National Cavalry in 1990. At present, I believe that this information
was misleading
.

Matchlock 16th December 2014 12:17 PM

11 Attachment(s)
In the Landeszeughaus Graz is an exact equivalent to the cartrigde box in the author's collection discussed in thread #10.
It shows the very same decoration with tiny star-shaped brass nails encircling the bone inlays. On almost other patrons from the same series delivered to the Graz arsenal, there are no nails.

It is the author's thesis is that the ones with the additional star-shaped nails were for officers.

Unlike the dating Robert Brooker suggested - ca. 1580-90 - the Graz arsenal records prove that this group of cartridge boxes definitely was part of the Nuremberg deliveries in 1577-78, so an exact date of two years is provided.

Scans are from Robert Brooker: Eine Radschloss-Sammung/A Wheellock Collection, Graz, 2007.

Best,
Michael


Atts.:
- the patron in the author's collection

- the equivalent in the Landeszeughaus Graz


Both came from the same series delivered to the Graz armory from Nuremberg in 1577-78, together with
wheellock puffers and other pieces of accouterment.

For some precious Saxon powder flasks, please see:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=19395




Matchlock 16th December 2014 04:06 PM

9 Attachment(s)
An early sample of a patron/cartridge box, ca. 1560-65, is in the reserve colletion of the Metroplitan Museum of Art, N.Y.,
see top two attachments.

Its edged construction is similar to the finely etched sample shown in post #42.

The following b/w
att. is a scan of an old photograph showing various types of patrons and a round flask, from the 1560's to the 1580's, from the collections of the Historisches Museum Dresden, the Rüstkammer.

Re-attached find a third sample from that Nuremberg made group of patrons, all of them ca. 1560, is in the Musée de l'Armée, Paris; with its etched and fire-gilt decoration it is the finest known. It is also important for historic weaponry because it is dated 1559; inv.no. M 21138 - cf. post #14.

The bottom att.
presents a but finely etched and edged patron of ca. 1550 in the Bargello, Firenze, from post #42, similar to the one in att.#1.


Best,
Michael

Matchlock 16th December 2014 05:28 PM

11 Attachment(s)
The one on top was sold Bonhams, 29.7.2009.

The two others Saxon, in the Dresden Rüstkammer.

Matchlock 16th December 2014 06:02 PM

11 Attachment(s)
A very unusual combined cartridge box/patron and powder flask, and with an addintional small compartment of unknown purpose, possibly for a worm and scourer for cleaning and clearing the barrel. The 9 tubes for paper cartridges are of tinned iron.
Probably ca. 1560-80, in the Landeszeughaus Graz, inv.no. 546/7.

The two bottom atts. depict a paper cartridge in the Graz arsenal, recovered from the barrel of alate 17th century flintlock musket!

All color scans from Robert Brooker: Eine Radschoß-Sammlung - A Wheellock Collection. Graz, 2008;
the b/w scans from Peter Krenn: Die Handfeuerwaffen des österreichischen Soldaten. Graz, 1986;
the three color photos copyrighted by the author, 1986.

Enjoy.

Best,
Michael


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