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-   -   Anglo-Indian Knives (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=23518)

Ian 3rd January 2018 08:12 PM

Anglo-Indian Knives
 
4 Attachment(s)
Two things come to mind when I read "Anglo-Indian knife." The first is the knives made in England in imitation of Indian knives. The Rogers company, for example, made several such knives.

The second is the knives made in India during the late 19th and early 20th C aimed specifically at European markets and British people who liked to travel to exotic places. There is a particular style that stands out in this regard. The most common of these is a knife that has a curved blade of polished steel with "Pure Steel," "Victory," and occasionally "Kirpan" reverse-etched at the forte. The hilts comprise small plates of MOP with interspersed straight or zig-zag black lines made of jet. A brass guard, ferrule and pommel are present, with a brass chain often linking the pointed pommel to the cross guard. The hilt is of full tang construction, with a screw thread on the end of the tang that takes a nut to hold the hilt in place. These knives originally came in a red leather sheath with a brass chape and locket. In my experience the chape tends to get lost first and later the lockets.

A less common variant of similar construction has a karud style blade of T-section, usually with a fuller, and a hilt of MOP with interspersed black jet, a brass ferrule and pommel, but no cross guard or chain; the hilt is again of full tang construction.

I have shown a small sample of these in the pictures below. Despite being mainly "tourist" knives, they are generally well made and attractive knives. There are quite a few of them around, so they are neither rare nor particularly valuable. I think the karud style is less common, and indeed knives of this form seem to be offered for sale at quite a high price these days.

The accompanying pictures illustrate the two styles and some of the marks found at forte. Close up views of the hilts show the MOP and jet construction.

I would be interested to see any other variants of this genre that folks have found over the years.

Ian.

thinreadline 4th January 2018 12:52 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian
Two things come to mind when I read "Anglo-Indian knife." The first is the knives made in England in imitation of Indian knives. The Rogers company, for example, made several such knives.

The second is the knives made in India during the late 19th and early 20th C aimed specifically at European markets and British people who liked to travel to exotic places. There is a particular style that stands out in this regard. The most common of these is a knife that has a curved blade of polished steel with "Pure Steel," "Victory," and occasionally "Kirpan" reverse-etched at the forte. The hilts comprise small plates of MOP with interspersed straight or zig-zag black lines made of jet. A brass guard, ferrule and pommel are present, with a brass chain often linking the pointed pommel to the cross guard. The hilt is of full tang construction, with a screw thread on the end of the tang that takes a nut to hold the hilt in place. These knives originally came in a red leather sheath with a brass chape and locket. In my experience the chape tends to get lost first and later the lockets.

A less common variant of similar construction has a karud style blade of T-section, usually with a fuller, and a hilt of MOP with interspersed black jet, a brass ferrule and pommel, but no cross guard or chain; the hilt is again of full tang construction.

I have shown a small sample of these in the pictures below. Despite being mainly "tourist" knives, they are generally well made and attractive knives. There are quite a few of them around, so they are neither rare nor particularly valuable. I think the karud style is less common, and indeed knives of this form seem to be offered for sale at quite a high price these days.

The accompanying pictures illustrate the two styles and some of the marks found at forte. Close up views of the hilts show the MOP and jet construction.

I would be interested to see any other variants of this genre that folks have found over the years.

Ian.

Very interesting to see such an excellent selection of variants of this interesting knife illustrated . I have had several of these over the years and never considered them to be as early as you describe , though I have no evidence of this , just an opinion. My gut feeling was that they were 1940s possibly made for sale to British servicemen as souvenirs in WW2, but as I say, w/o any evidence to support this view. I see them fairly often at militaria shows , very often described as '19th C midshipman's dirks' which of course is ludicrous. Superb collection Ian.

Ian 4th January 2018 07:36 AM

3 Attachment(s)
Here are a couple more examples of sold items from the Oriental Arms site.

.

thinreadline 4th January 2018 01:22 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian
Here are a couple more examples of sold items from the Oriental Arms site.

.


yes those handles are very similar in style.

David R 4th January 2018 02:24 PM

1 Attachment(s)
I bought this one some time ago from an internet dealer. Engraved on a panel of the grip, "India 1943" so this one is definitely WW2 era. A nice sturdy blade with signs of differential hardening, alas now pitted from neglect.

Kmaddock 7th January 2018 07:45 PM

6 Attachment(s)
Hi
Here is my version, I reckoned Indian but this is as far as I went
Do you think it is from same family tree
Overall37 cm
Blade is 26 cm

Handle feels v cold like some sort of stone
Regards
Ken

Ian 8th January 2018 01:54 PM

Hi Ken,

The blade looks similar but the jadeite hilt scales are obviously different. Its age is hard to assess, but perhaps later than the ones I have shown. Nice looking knife.

Ian.

Kmaddock 8th January 2018 03:01 PM

Hi Ian,

The shape of the brass finial on the top of the blade at the bolster looks practically identical to your example without the chain.

I picked the knife up in a swap and i have no idea of where it came from, the brass on the handle is v shiny, cleaned before i got it but brass on the neck of the scabbard looks old, they are a perfect fit together though.

It is a v sharp blade and definitely usable.

Regards
Ken

Kubur 8th January 2018 05:35 PM

I disagree with Ian.
This knife is much older than the others.
The others are late 19th c. early 20th c.
Your knife Ken is probably early 19thc. with a very nice Agate hilt and a very nice sheat, Indian of course.
Not recent at all and much better than the others!

A. G. Maisey 8th January 2018 07:09 PM

Much better, or much older?

Kmaddock 8th January 2018 07:21 PM

Hi all
Nice to see this knife being of interest.
I had it in my mistake acquisition pile, might the blade be potentially be worth etching.
Regards
Ken

Kubur 8th January 2018 07:48 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey
Much better, or much older?


Both my general
:)
here another one...

Sajen 8th January 2018 09:16 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian
Its age is hard to assess, but perhaps later than the ones I have shown.


Agree with the first half of the sentence but for the second; it could be older though. :shrug:

Just see, Kubur think similar!

Sajen 8th January 2018 09:21 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey
Much better, or much older?


I think both! :)


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