Ethnographic Arms & Armour

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-   -   alameng raja (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=18967)

Ganja Iras 24th August 2014 07:05 PM

alameng raja
 
1 Attachment(s)
i presenting the pic of an old bugis alameng
in gold ,diamonds and emerald
a very rare blade and very good condition of scabard and hilt
any comments are welcom

Cheers ,

ganja iras

Robert 25th August 2014 01:25 AM

Wonderful, Is there any way that you could post close-up detailed photos of the hilt, blade, scabbard ?

Best,
Robert

Battara 25th August 2014 01:27 AM

This is the nicest example I have ever seen! :eek:

I have seen pictures of one in silver, but not gold.........Thank you.

What museum is this from?

VVV 25th August 2014 06:40 AM

Is it from Sumbawa?

Michael

Sajen 25th August 2014 07:37 AM

Hello Ganja Iras,

would like to see some close ups when possible. Here you can see my one in silver: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showt...ghlight=alamang

Regards,
Detlef

Ganja Iras 25th August 2014 02:11 PM

Hi
 
Hi guys ,

I am sorry that i cant give you more detils pic's now ,but i will do it soon.
and it is from sumbawa ,collected by a young ancient weapons collector in lombok
Thanks ,
Ganja iras

CharlesS 25th August 2014 06:47 PM

Lovely, superb example....certainly the cream of the crop of Alamangs from top to bottom.

Ganja Iras 25th August 2014 08:28 PM

hi
 
12 Attachment(s)
dear folks ,
here some more pic's of the Alameng and that the best i can do...sorry..

kind regards ,

ganja iras

Tim Simmons 25th August 2014 09:07 PM

It has a rather rough look for goldsmiths work? Have you tested the metal with the correct acids?

VVV 25th August 2014 09:10 PM

Thanks for the close ups.

It's interesting that it has several quite unique features compared to those found in old pictures and collections.
Does your friend know anything more about it?
Does it have any provenance?

Michael

Ganja Iras 25th August 2014 09:26 PM

Hi
 
Hi Michael ,
Thanks for your comments and appreciating my simple post.
Last time i talk to the owner of the alameng ,he only told me about the gold on the sarung and hilt ( 18 karats ) ,the stone is indian emerald and diamonds.
He also told me that he obtain the weapon from Bima ( west nusa tenggara ).
Some of his collections are bugis and most of them are kerisses.
i saw many lombok keris in his display room ,but none of them are for sale and i am not allowed to take a picture in it.

Thanks.

Battara 26th August 2014 12:03 AM

The scabbard looks like it is alloyed with silver, not uncommon in that region of the world. Thank you for the close ups!

A. G. Maisey 26th August 2014 12:08 AM

I believe testing will reveal that this dress is gilt over silver.

Battara 26th August 2014 01:52 AM

Alan, that is also a real possibility.

Sajen 26th August 2014 06:28 AM

I also agree by this, I have a Bugis keris in similar fashion where the dress is gilt over silver.
Nice alamang!

Regards,
Detlef

Ganja Iras 26th August 2014 05:43 PM

Hi
 
Dear guys ,
Thanks to all of you for the comments .
I think i forget something that this scabard has been tested ,and its solid gold in 18 karats.
Regards ,

Ganja iras

Battara 26th August 2014 07:02 PM

Then it is probably alloyed with silver, not uncommon as mentioned previously....

Ganja Iras 26th August 2014 08:07 PM

As far as i know ,here in lombok and also bali ,the one who alloyed with silver we call it "SILIASIH " or there is another kind of combination gold & silver we call PIJAHAN / GANDONGAN.
and this one is not one of that kind ,cause its a solid gold in low quality
Thanks

Sajen 26th August 2014 10:03 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ganja Iras
As far as i know ,here in lombok and also bali ,the one who alloyed with silver we call it "SILIASIH " or there is another kind of combination gold & silver we call PIJAHAN / GANDONGAN.
and this one is not one of that kind ,cause its a solid gold in low quality
Thanks


18 karat gold means that it is an alloy from 75% gold and 25% silver & copper so far I know. 24 karat mean 99,99% gold content also called fine gold. Here in Europ we have as "good" gold this 18 karat gold because it is more hard. But I know that in Indonesia "good" gold has 23 karat.

Regards,
Detlef

Battara 27th August 2014 11:50 PM

Plus it can be gold alloyed with silver and still be 18k gold........

kerisbiz 6th November 2017 02:02 AM

I'm not sure this is a full 18k gold, possibly a gold-plated silver blend material. I have some original toraja sulawesi, and you probably have not made it in Sulawesi because the material and shape of the blade is different. The materials used are also the same as madura kamardhikan kris.
In the handle part is also disproportionate shape, the original sword handle has a philosophy and size, not originally made.


Battara 6th November 2017 08:39 PM

So are you saying that this example is a "foreign" made copy?

Interesting. Would you be able to provide pictures of indigenous examples for comparison please?

Sajen 7th November 2017 10:58 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Battara
So are you saying that this example is a "foreign" made copy?


I think he want to say exactly this but I have to disagree, blade shape and constuction is correct, the handle don't look very ergonomic but it's not made for fight and I have seen similar shaped handles and the workmanship don't look recent to my eyes. Others may think different! :shrug:

Regards,
Detlef

kerisbiz 13th November 2017 12:50 AM

I see this sword is not an old sword, I found there are some sulawesi heirlooms derived from ntb wrapped in gold but a form of engraving that seems not made by goldsmith. It is impossible that the king's sword is made by amateurs. Pamor shape and sword shape that is different from the natural sulawesi. pamor 'tongko siso' shaped large, the front edge of the sword shrank and looks dubious. the original average sword has a simple prestige and the sharp side there is 'rakkapeng' at the base with the sword of King Gowa and Raja Bone


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