A bit unusual keris
 

Hi guys,

Nothing much about this one. Only the size is rather unusual. Ganja to tip is 18". The blade curves and ends at a very narrow point. I think its for piercing chainmails. Its rather heavy as the thickness at ganja is around 1 cm. Pamor is as typical bugis blades, ujung gunung+wos wutah and wengkon. Its not too clear however. Sorry that the pictures are not that nice. I took it in nightime. Still trying to figure out the best way to take pictures. :o

In spite of my hesitation to jump into the "shark pool" with you guys, I like this keris very much, rasdan. ;) Thank you for sharing with us.

Was chain mail common in Indonesia at any time? If not, why would an empu make a mail-piercing blade (if that's what it is)?

Hi Andrew,

The Bugis use chainmails. Theres one or two specimen of theese mails in museums in KL. I think they got the idea from their neighbouring Moros. :)

So, Pak Rasdan

Do you think it was used against the Bugis (17-19th century) or against the Portuguese and Dutch (15th century)?

Er, sorry but I can't tell if this is a Malay oir Bugis keris? Maklumlah just beginning :o

I like the beauty of simplicity of this thick graceful Bugis sepokal blade well complemented by it's matching pendokok. Good find and syabas.

Hi guys,

From my point of view this keris is in straits bugis style (slightly curved and convex cross section) and I think it's used by the straits bugis during the war with Siak in 1700's. However i havent done any research regarding this to support my opinion. :o

Thanks John, nevertheless i still highly admiring your rhino horn bugis. Its simply stunning. :D

Sulawesi!! :)

Nice keris, its beauty lies in its simplicity. Wonder how old the scabbard is. More likely the Bugis developed armor before the Moro because of thier manner of combat with blow guns. This may be handy in dispatching a wounded armored warrior. "The Narrative of Captain David Woodard" is an interesting account of a group of sailors, lost at sea, & thier 2.5 years as prisoners of varying Sulawesi groups in the late 18thC. Woodard gives a first hand account of a battle between 2 villages. Also describes ceremonies where bird shaped hilts made of horn were given for acts of bravery on the battlefield for thier daggers & creese (described as 24" blades). Wonder if the origins of the horn Bugis hilts was reserved for warriors that had been deemed worthy.

From what I've been able to ascertain, chainmail was indeed used throughout the region, often with tortoise shell, brass, bone or even fish scale plates incorporated into it, plus many tribes in the area also wore "war jackets" of very heavy woven plant fibre manufacture.
Many were extremely decorative as well as functional and would have been effective against small blades, darts and even arrows, so a thicker, very pointed thrusting blade would have been perfect against these as well.
I think the effectiveness of even many slashing type short swords would have been greatly reduced as well....try a slashing stroke against one of the thick, woven door mats seen everywhere in the northern US and it will give you a fair comparison.
Then try a thrust with a very thin, pointed blade and I think you'll find it slides through almost without noticable impedence.
Mike

Thanks guys,

I think Conogre's remarks makes a lot of sense though we may dont wanna try it in the yard and get our neighbours selling their homes cheap and moving out fast. :D (Quoting Radu) Just kidding Mike. :)

I searched for the book Bill mentioned in the library but its in the red tab section. Then looked for it in the internet shops...no wonder its in the red tab, the price is between AUD825 to more than USD 1000!! Thanks for info Bill. I'm sure that horn or ivory kerdas (bird shaped) hilt can be regarded as a token of bravery. Theres not much in the market and this surely reflect the standard of such article in the old days. Sometimes i got the feeling that the horn ones are harder to find. (Just a feeling). :)

Hi Blu, i'm a bit blurrred about the line that divides sulawesi bugis keris and strait/ riau bugis keris either on the nature of the blade or the fittings. Can u kindly shed some light on this? At the moment i just regard the penghulu sampir as sulawesi and the thinner sampir, narowing characteristics of the batang and flaring buntut as straits bugis. Your help is highly appreciated. :)

Regards,
Rasdan

Rasdan: http://www.elibron.com/english/searc...=25&search.y=7 , still not cheap, think this one may be up Ricks alley, also has a few other accounts of shipwrecked sailors.

At last, one option. Thank you very much Bill. :)

A few things made me think its Sulawesi. First, the pendoko is the long-stemmed form type, which is more typical of Sulawesi than Straits. Straits Bugis tend to use the 'short-stemmed', wide-rimmed pendoko. The kerdas hilt should also shed some clues, but from the angle of the pictures, I can't tell.

Secondly, the sheath has this 'awkwardness' (not in the bad sense, its probably just our sense of aesthetics in this part of the Malay/Straits Bugis world is different from the Sulawesi Bugis). Its difficult to describe, but Sulawesi-made sampir has this 'unpleasantness' that contrasts with the 'sweeter', better-shaped Straits Bugis type of sampir. Also, the batang has this bulge (swollen part) near the top. Straits Bugis batang tends to be more 'straight-up straight-down'. The buntut too -- oversized and odd-looking, adds to the awkward feel.

The blade is the hardest to tell the origins from because the blade outlasts the fittings and do travel around the region and gets dressed up to suit the owner's culture and tastes. But this blade has again this characteristic Sulawesi 'awkwardness' that I do think its a Sulawesi blade. And of course the sheer proportions and thickness of this blade is 101% Bugis garang-ness. :)

Great catch!!!

See one of my previous post -- see the 'awkward' resemblance.
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...=warrior+keris

Sorry, this is off-topic.

Blu - that 'x' on the ganja of your warrior keris -- could it the empu's signature. I read somewhere that sometimes, when an empu is satisfied with a piece of his work, he would leave behind his mark. Could this be one?

I have a riau keris that has a curious mark on its ganja, not an 'x'.

Hi Blu,

Thanks for clearing up the point. However Frey in his book seperated sort of a Minang keris as Sumatra-Bugis keris. U know.. thick sampir, high pointed tip of sampir. Other than that he stated as Sulawesi kerisses. I'll try to scan the page to ease our reference.

Rasdan, Blu is spot on with the Sulawesi provenance. Compare with this example below - note especially the lack of a "picitan" on the side of the sampir but also just the overall shape. You will never see a Straits Bugis keris like this.

Rasdan, Blu is spot on with the Sulawesi provenance. Compare with this example below - note especially the lack of a "picitan" on the side of the sampir but also just the overall shape. You may see Sulawesi keris that look very close to a Straits Bugis keris but you will never see a Straits Bugis keris like this.

Thanks Dave. I think i'll start a new thread as soon as possible regarding this topic. :)

Hi Rasdan,

I missed this entirely until just now. :o

Thanks for the explanation. Interesting stuff. I've been a proponant of mail-piercing tips on pesh kabz and various Indo-Persian forms, but have not given much thought to the SEA weapons in this role.



Magabani, don't you have a full set of Moro mail?

Hi Andrew,

Heres some armour used by Malays. The first is made of tin and the second made of crocodile skin. :eek:

wow!

Pak Rasdan -- are these photos from Muzium Negara KL? I don't recall ever seeing them.

With armor like these, the Malays don't have to worry about being kebal ;)

Are these bullet-proof? I don't mean from an M-16 but rather from a 19th century musket.

They are from Selangor Muzium in Shah Alam, Rahman. Bullet proof? Nah.. i dont think so. Actually i wanted to take some pictures of a kemuning tree behind the Muzium, but to my suprise it was "trimmed" and not much is left to see. But it'll survive i think.

These both look like examples of Nias war jackets .
Any provenance with the display ?

Hi Rick,

I'm not sure. Theres no caption on these items. Sorry. If u hav samples of Nias war jackets, can u kindly show us?

Regards

Nias Armor
 

Like this .

WOW!! I've seen the pic before but didnt notice it. This shows how ignorant i am. Thanks man!! I'll have the museum informed.

Book reference...
 

For book reference, see...:)

Traditional Weapons of the Indonesian Archipelago
by Albert G. Van Zonneveld

Hardcover: 160 pages
Publisher: Kitlv Press (July 1, 2002)
ISBN: 9054500042

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/90...CLZZZZZZZ_.jpg

Thanks, Alam. :)

A picture of Bugis kerises from a 1916 Dutch Publication.
 

Whilst we have been on Sulawesi/Bugis... From the publication - HOUTSNIJWERK EN METAALBEWERKING IN NEDERLANDSCH-INDIE. PUBLISHER: DEBUSSY, AMSTERDAM, 1916.

Bugis Keris in ACM
 

While we're on this subject, there's always one thing I wanted to ask Dave. Last month I visited the Asian Civilisations Museum across the bay from the Cavanagh bridge.
I was intrigued to see one of the kerises in the display. It has a nogo blade if I'm not mistaken but it was provenanced Bugis (again, if memory serves me right). I don't know if anyone else here, especially the orang Singapure have ever noticed this particular blade (inside the Malay world gallery).
Were the Bugis smiths also manufacturing blade types similar to those by the Javanese empus or was this one a trade blade? hmmm :)

That blade is a true-blue straits bugis blade, not a javanese blade. Thick, broad, robust, in full bugis glory. The naga is also not of javanese form.

Just happened to chance upon this thread (post) via url from the "Question About SEA Armor" thread. I vividly remember seeing this particular gorgeous solid sturdy tegap strait Bugis Naga keris at the ACM during my visit there in April and particularly like it's coherent form. The other rather catchy and outstanding piece was the Peninsular (?) keris blade with 10 different pamors (if I remember correctly). Almost gives one the impression that it might be it's smith's final attempt to register as much of his key pamor skills onto that blade like a "textbook" he wanted left behind.

Naga Blades
 

Hi John,

I think Naga blades can both be a joy and frustration to collectors. From conversations I had with collectors who put a lot of faith in lore and a bit less on systematic book learning (my approach is a combination of both I guess) they have this belief that keris with Naga were meant for royals and blue bloods only. And talking about Java, such keris were probably spread around hundreds of Priyayi from your Raden Mas up to your Kanjeng Pagerans etc. Getting a good old one would be a great thing.
However, the naga motif today is also one of the most mass produced pattern you get on cheap tourist blades made from Madura, with a kind of yellow metal inlay that imitates Kinatah blades.
There are occassionally good newly made blades of this kind, and I think it's OK to buy them, just for the sake of keeping the craft alive, but you have people who try and pass the as older stuff. Bad.
Hence the reason why I stick to Malay kerises. ;)

Maybe I'm getting old. It has just been old or fairly old Bugis for me the past couple of years...and waiting for 2 more old Bugis from England... ;)

Hi John,

I think that's a Javanese keris. Yes, really brings a tear to the eye... its so beautiful...

Hey, show us your 2 old 'babies' when they arrive ok. :)

Hi Kai Wee,

Pity I didn't bring my camera that day as ACM does allow photography without flash.

The 2 old "babes" will make a transit at Singapore so probably you could take a look in person and perhaps offer some restoration recommendations prior to them moving on to Kelantan for the purpose. If they turn out well, I probably will put up pictures here or at the KampungNet.

Hi John,

Pity I couldn't meet up with you when you last visit Singapore. When you next visit, do let me know. We can meet up, along with some other keris enthusiasts.

I believe your 2 pieces will be at Adni's, when it comes? May I see it, too. :D

Certainly and many thanks for the kind open invitation! Only keris enthusiast I was lucky enough to meet was Mr Chew (MyKampung). If only Adni didn't have to go to KL so soon (within hours of our meeting), he would have been able to arrange for meeting with a few friends like Kai Wee, Paul etc. Sayang lah but certainly will make it the next trip.

Of course. The more the merrier. :) The pieces are said to be from the collection of the late Evan Perry, armourer to the Tower of London.

Whoa John, I'm already feeling jealous from the sound of it. :)

Hopefully I can get to see them, but I can only hope because my system project is ramping up for launch at the end of the year, and my working hours are getting really bad (was in office past midnight yesterday).

Kai Wee, now I'm getting a little worried in case they fall short of your expectations. :D

Yeah, I know what it's like in a Bank...have been past midnights and weekends as well. Good luck in your project.