Ethnographic Arms & Armour

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-   -   Little boarding axe? (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=24945)

carlos 11th May 2019 11:56 AM

Little boarding axe?
 
6 Attachment(s)
I just adquired this little axe, similar like boarding axes I have seen.
There are a mark in blade, maybe Peugeot freres, but I haven, t information.
Any Information about this piece ?
Thanks

CutlassCollector 11th May 2019 07:11 PM

Hi carlos,

Nice axe. I have seen several of these and I believe that it is a late 19th or early 20th century French fireman's hatchet but it is a direct descendant of the French boarding axe and closely copies it.
Its small size make it unlikely to be a boarding axe as it is maybe 300mm long with a blade to spike point of perhaps 185mm. Even the smaller models of French boarding axes were more like 530mm by 230mm.

Peugeot freres have a long history of tool manufacture and go back at least to 1850.

I have seen one of these marked with the Free French cross indicating it was still in use in WWII.

Regards,CC

Jim McDougall 11th May 2019 08:54 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by CutlassCollector
Hi carlos,

Nice axe. I have seen several of these and I believe that it is a late 19th or early 20th century French fireman's hatchet but it is a direct descendant of the French boarding axe and closely copies it.
Its small size make it unlikely to be a boarding axe as it is maybe 300mm long with a blade to spike point of perhaps 185mm. Even the smaller models of French boarding axes were more like 530mm by 230mm.

Peugeot freres have a long history of tool manufacture and go back at least to 1850.

I have seen one of these marked with the Free French cross indicating it was still in use in WWII.

Regards,CC



CC, while not a collector nor having knowledge in this field, I just wanted to thank you for the detailed info and insight into this interesting axe. I wondered if it could be a firemans axe, and it is great to learn from the example shared and observations, so very much appreciated.

kronckew 12th May 2019 07:42 AM

2 Attachment(s)
I have one of the fire axes too. As noted, the boarding axe had a longer haft, it also had a belt hook on the side of the head to keep it secure on your belt. The Boarding axe usually had a similarly grooved grip area, missing from yours as required by the French blueprints I've seen. Nice little axes. French ones had the languets fore/aft to protect against missing and breaking the handle. British axes had them on the sides, like the UK boarding axes which had them there to prevent the head being cut off That evolved into the fire version where that was not really necessary.

Mine is in pic below too), it's also slightly smaller/lighter than the French one.

corrado26 12th May 2019 11:51 AM

4 Attachment(s)
Fot those who are able to read and understand a second language here copies of the opus of Christian Aries concerning French bording axes
corrado26

CutlassCollector 12th May 2019 07:12 PM

Jim,
Thanks for the encouragement - I'm mostly in awe of the vast knowledge to be found here and it's good to be able to give a little bit back once in a while.

And

Kronckew - Good point about the belt hook which is normally found on French Boarding axes.
I remember your axe - it's rare as well.

Regards, CC

corrado26 13th May 2019 11:32 AM

apparently the pages od Aries are not of interest, so please excuse me having tried to help, I shall not do it once more again!
corrado26

CutlassCollector 13th May 2019 11:54 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by corrado26
apparently the pages od Aries are not of interest, so please excuse me having tried to help, I shall not do it once more again!
corrado26


Please don't think that Corrado - all information and help is always appreciated. There are just not that many people interested in boarding axes!
Aries documents are not that easy to find and although dating from the late 1960's early 70's they are still mostly accurate - so it is a good post.

I also have an English translation if anyone is interested.

Regards,
CC

kronckew 13th May 2019 12:13 PM

I appreciate the drawings too. French is not one of my languages, unless I can scan it in and paste it in Google translate :D, so I did not comment further. Again, Vielen Danke. Do not feel slighted.

CC, An English translation would be most helpful and also appreciated.

CutlassCollector 13th May 2019 01:44 PM

CC, An English translation would be most helpful and also appreciated.[/QUOTE]

Hi Kronckew,
It took me a while to find a copy of the original and I eventually got one from the British Library on condition that I did not reproduce or publish anywhere. So I am reluctant to put it on here, but I will pm you the English translation.
Can't find it on the pc at the moment so may have to scan it in.
I should warn you it's a rough translation!!

Regards,
CC

kronckew 13th May 2019 03:07 PM

Thanks. French does seem to be a bit less precise (with ambiguities) language anyway ;)

fernando 13th May 2019 03:18 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by kronckew
Thanks. French does seem to be a bit less precise (with ambiguities) language anyway ;)


:rolleyes:

Jim McDougall 13th May 2019 03:54 PM

Udo, please don't take that approach, that entry with Aries was perfect!!! and although I do not speak any other languages, I can easily muddle through French in some degree, especially along with images :) I wish I had Aries, but it is the one resource I never was able to obtain. Expensive and hard to find complete sets.
Your entries with Aries recently 'pulled me out of the hole' when I was stumped with a sword I was researching, and I envied your holding of that valuable reference!!! not to mention your thoughtfulness in seeking and presenting it.

There are 'mountains of knowledge' here, and in the world of arms study, I would go as far as saying, here are the 'Himalayas', and your peak is very high! along with so many others.
Like CC, I have learned so much here, and every effort I make to try to add what I can is to give back in gratitude.

It is very much quid pro quo, and we all learn together.

For me, seeing this entry from Aries was wonderful, and as I mentioned, I have now learned about these axes, and especially from a much envied resource which myself and many others will probably never have.

REALLY good work here guys!!! Thank you.

corrado26 13th May 2019 04:56 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim McDougall
For me, seeing this entry from Aries was wonderful, and as I mentioned, I have now learned about these axes, and especially from a much envied resource which myself and many others will probably never have.



As I have the complete French volumes of the "Aries", a really fantastic source, you are welcome with further questions. I'll try to help where I can.
corrado26

carlos 13th May 2019 05:42 PM

Thanks everybody!!!!
Your information is very useful to me !!!
Thanks again
Carlos

CutlassCollector 13th May 2019 08:02 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by kronckew
Thanks. French does seem to be a bit less precise (with ambiguities) language anyway ;)


Hi, I've emailed you the english translation.

My translator said she was fluent!..... but not so easy translating 18/19th century terminology for axes so some of the word choices are a bit strange but you'll get the drift.

More pictures and info available on my French page at boardingaxe.com if anyone likes axes.

Regards, CC

Fernando K 13th May 2019 11:09 PM

Hello

only to say that the upper word ends in G E O T and the lower word in R E S (Freres?)

Affectionately

fernando 14th May 2019 11:28 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fernando K
Hello

only to say that the upper word ends in G E O T and the lower word in R E S (Freres?)

Affectionately

Yes, PEUGEOT FRERES, as seen by Carlos. Although, i guess, a peculiar situation in that, usually this mark has a deeper stamping and is shown next to a symbol (lion ...).

corrado26 14th May 2019 03:53 PM

The lion is the firm logo of the PEUGEOT S.A. still today
corrado26

fernando 14th May 2019 05:49 PM

4 Attachment(s)
I am aware of that, Udo ;)
... The one and the other are THE SAME

.


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