^^

I believe in what you are saying, and it would make sense to do so. This keeps the wheels turning for all parties and this is how a system "evolves". Bruce Lee being the best example and greatest innovator of what you speak of. His style was basically stealing techniques and moves from several arts and making them his own. Did I say stealing?...maybe I should of said borrowing. :D BUT, I can only agree with you up to a certain extent. Personally, I have seen many things that just don't make any sense to me in Martial Arts(not just FMA). Giving away or sharing trade secrets can only work up to a certain point...anything beyond and that is now the head chief giving away his treasured recipes. It is what keeps food on the table, a roof over your head, and clothes on your kids backs..all the while sticking with tradition of the ones who came before and established the art. Some of the more advanced teachings and/or secrets would only make sense to the practitioner who has been studying that particular art for a long time. But still, I can see how a chief can share ideas and put twists on dishes that are universal...that I would say is as far as I would see it going for more traditional schools. Grabbing certain secrets and/or moves from different arts for your own benefit helps you become a more well rounded fighter, BUT, the person also loses the essence behind the other arts he grabbed from. Essence as in foundation, a true understanding, or history to go by. Evolving is a good thing...but that is also not for everyone. Not everyone wants to evolve or follow the path most Martial Art schools have gone today...most of which is now geared towards "SPORT" fighting. Sport fighting will not save you on the street. My own school, we tend to stick to traditional eskrima...which is older style from the 50-60s. Why?..because that was considered the golden era of stick fighting, where there were death matches. My own teachers belief...he wants to keep the old school tradition in its purest form(nothing added) and not evolve...as he feels the style from the death match era is what works best on the street. And personally, this is why FMA is considered one of the best and most raw of all martial arts. Forget all that fancy stick twirling most FMA school glamorize, in true raw form FMA isn't pretty, but it is straight to the point and it works. This is why it is so effect on the street...and when street fighting, the most dangerous person is not the guy you are fighting, it is the guys friends that you have to be more aware of. FMA has always took in to account multiple attackers...but now a days, with MMA and WEKAF, most FMA schools are also going the sport route. And after much training in his class, I notice we tend to stay on the old path. Just to throw this out there...what I find always works best is simple and basic striking. But the key is more then just Bunal(striking)...the key is to hit and not get hit. You can apply that to any art. Every single school will teach you how to hit...but how many schools teach you on how to NOT get hit.

I know that all sounds like I am rambling. I guess basically what I am trying to say is, everyone has a preference on how and what they want to learn. Me personally, I wanted to learn a traditional FMA...aside from just pure self defense on the street; I wanted to learn for the cultural heritage part. So obviously, a FMA school that changes with the times by adding this and that and does what every other martial art school is doing; that really is not for me. Hope that all made sense. :)

Just to mention, I have been reading this book. And wow, there is a wealth of information on how FMA came to be. I strongly suggest reading this book if you are curious on the development of FMA(particularly eskrima from the Visayas region) during the Spanish/Moro era. Everything just makes so much more sense to me. :D Not everything in the book is concrete evidence, but much of it makes good sense and gives one a much better understanding of the overall history. Other aspects not clearly answered should open other doors to look through for more information..in other words, having better direction on where to look.

Just a bit of info from the book. In a nut shell... If seeking info on Moro arts, look to Silat. FMA, Arnis, and eskrima in general does NOT follow any form of Moro martial art. Any FMA art not falling under Silat that uses Moro clothing and weapons should be questioned. Eskrima is a tried and true Filipino Christian martial art unique to only the Philippines and evolved from fighting with the Moro raiders. :D

We also remember that when the Spanish first took Manila there was a Moro Datu or Sultan there at the time .

They might have been more than occasional raiders .

Yup, to each his own, and what you said makes a lot of sense. Thanks also for the summary of that book you mentioned.

Hello Rick. Yes, there were several Moro rajahs ruling Manila and environs then, when the Spaniards came during the mid- to late-1500s.

Islam was not as widespread then in northern Philippines (i.e., Luzon), like it was in the southern Phils. then (i.e., Sulu and Mindanao). And central Phils. (i.e., the Visayas) were the least influenced by Islam at that time.

Just to clarify the terms describing Phil. precolonial form of government --

Datu - the head of a barangay (pronounced buh-rung-GUY), which population consisted from just a few families, to several hundred persons; a barangay is run fairly independently vs. other barangays; thus a barangay is the basic political unit, and all of the Philippines' peoples then were organized in this manner.

Raja - a datu who was designated by his peers as the head of an alliance of several barangays; thus Raja Sulaiman was one of the three rajas who ruled precolonial greater Manila then which consisted of many barangays.

Sultan - a sultan is the leader of a much larger geographical area, and there would be rajas and datus under the sultan (like in the sultanates of Sulu and Maguindanao, respectively).

Now on the Moro raids of old, they were done by southern Philippine Moros for two things -- (a) as an act of retribution against the incursion of Spaniards against their homeland (Sulu/Mindanao), and (b) as a means of boosting their rising local economy via the procurement of more manpower.

There were plenty of good and arable land everywhere. Thus conquest of territory did not make sense. It was the people who were the precious "commodities" -- thus, slave raiding was the sensible political and economic move.

As for the 16th century Luzon Moros, they were not engaged in raiding, as there were no Christians then to get irritated at :)

And perhaps the local population was able to support the Manila economy.

On a related matter, historians also say that the reason Luzon and Visayas fell easily to the colonizers was precisely because of the loose alliance amongst the barangays.

In the case of Sulu and Mindanao however, their higher level of political cohesiveness (via the sultanate) allowed them to resist the colonizers more effectively.

Thanks Miguel for explaining the order of the titles . :)

I wonder about the silat connection to original Moro systems. I will not deny that there may be some relation, but from what I have seen of silat, it seems to go mostly near the ground. From some old photos of the turn of the centyr and a particular Moro practitioner on Cecil Quirino's Crossing the Sulu Seas, Moro martial arts may not be as low to the ground as silat.

Just my limited observations so far.......

weapons and trading the Philippines pre-Spanish & Spanish colonial day
 

Guys,
FMA was been impacted by the constant raiders & settlers from many places. Raiding became an form of commerce. Blades were traded for and many types of blades were used. Yes there are local adaptaion and creations as well. It was so bad that English and thier trade ships were plaged by Moro Pirates. If you want read a excellent book that also refferes to the weapons complete with sketches read the Pirate Wind. You can get it from Austrialan, Hong Kong and England book sellers. The English did great job of documenting their enemies of trade. If you get the chance read the book you get really great feel about the southern Philippines in the 1700- 1800s. It was amazing place and times.

Sounds good! I'll see if I can find it here--I live in Hong Kong. :)

Just wanted to add some input after spending time with Tausug and Yakan tribesmen in the Southern Philippines--culturally there are strong ties to Malaysia in so many ways. I now see the myriad of connections that influence all cultures throughout the Philippines after having spent so much time here this year.

Both the Tausugs and Yakan have terms for their fighting systems, and like many words in Bahasa Sug and Yakan, they are somewhat similar to words in Malay. The term for their fighting systems is something like silat, but I can't remember what it is now. Silat is NOT always low to the ground. If you look at Seni Gayong from Malaysia, or Minangkabau Sitarlak, both systems are relatively upright. There is a strong possibility Chinese fighting systems did influence the Bangsamoro, however. Chinese kung fu systems have affected Javanese systems. The Chinese, to this day, live among the Tausug and Yakan on Basilan and Sulu, and we have all seen barungs with Chinese characters on them.

I wish I could get a taste of the Tausug fighting systems, but traveling to Jolo or Patikul at this point in time is a really bad idea unless you have ransom money ready at home. I doubt they would even be willing to teach their systems to the Yakan, even though there is relative peace between the tribes now and members of both tribes work and live together in the Abu Sayyaf/MILF/MNLF and even intermarry.