BANGKINANG & BAHARI kerises? [Archive] - Ethnographic Arms & Armour

Amuk Murugul

23rd June 2008, 03:52 AM

Hullo everybody,

From the viewpoint of an Oerang Soenda:

- based only on length; yes, the short one (LHS) can be called 'bahari' and the longer one (RHS) a 'Bangkinang'

- the Bangkinang was developed in answer to the Portuguese rapier, mainly for use on horse-back (read 'pony-back'). So it was straight (no eloeks/waves) and concentrated more on steel content than pamor/damascene patterns). Also, the Bangkinang did not have a tonggong/back-bone). Last of all, the bedor/tang had a flat section to prevent rotation.

Best.

ganjawulung

23rd June 2008, 06:33 AM

... the Bangkinang was developed in answer to the Portuguese rapier, mainly for use on horse-back (read 'pony-back'). So it was straight (no eloeks/waves) and concentrated more on steel content than pamor/damascene patterns). Also, the Bangkinang did not have a tonggong/back-bone). Last of all, the bedor/tang had a flat section to prevent rotation.

Sumuhun (thanks -- in Soenda dialect), kang Amuk... Once again I post pics of the blades but without hilt. The pesi (or 'bedor' in your term) of the longer keris is not flat as you mentioned. But round -- though bigger than the normal kerises, even a bit bigger than Balinese blade (but not longer).

The Malays of Sumatra & Peninsula call these dapors as keris Penyalang. Some would simply call them keris Panjang.

BTW, are the hilts original to the blade, or are they much later additions? I never saw this type of hilt in a keris Penyalang / Panjang before.

Dear Penangsang, the hilt belongs to the longer one. It is not ivory, but perhaps old 'duyung' teeth. I got the 'keris panjang' with such hilt (keris Bangkinang in Javanese term -- Bangkinang is a name of a small place in the southwest of Pekanbaru Riau, Sumatera to the direction of Padang, Sumatera Barat. This place, believed to be the 'origin' of such keris model or at least popularized from this place before 19th century). The style of sheath is Palembang, but the wooden "gandar" (blade section sheath) is no more original. Maybe broken, and changed with trembalo wood gandar..

sukuh

23rd June 2008, 06:47 AM

Dear Ganjawulung,

On several occasions I heard people talk about the "executionerskeris" when the subject was bangkinang.
Please tell me, do you think that remark is plausible or just a story?

thanks Sukuh

ganjawulung

23rd June 2008, 07:18 AM

On several occasions I heard people talk about the "executionerskeris" when the subject was bangkinang.
Please tell me, do you think that remark is plausible or just a story?

Dear Sukuh, I think David van Duuren has written on this matter in his book, The Kris (1996, 1998). Please page 87,

"... the slender and straight keris panjang, or 'long kris', which also used for executions. One of those executions was described by a Dutch eyewitness. The prisoner crouched on the ground, his back to the executioner. Below his left shoulder was glued a thick wad of cotton fluff, the 'rose'. When the moment had come, the executioner attacked with a swift and perfect thrust, penetrating straignt through the back and into the heart. Death was instantaneous; the cotton absorbed the small quantity of flowing blood...,"

"In earlier days, execution by the kris was, in Indonesia, to some degree considered a 'good dead'; it was much more dignified than simply having one's head cut off...,"

sukuh

23rd June 2008, 10:00 AM

In earlier days, execution by the kris was, in Indonesia, to some degree considered a 'good dead'; it was much more dignified than simply having one's head cut off...
Dear Ganjawulung,

If I had to choose I would prefer that method too... :o
So, correct me if I'm wrong, bangkinang was used for that purpose but not specialy made for it, as I was told..?

ganjawulung

23rd June 2008, 11:31 AM

So, correct me if I'm wrong, bangkinang was used for that purpose but not specialy made for it, as I was told..?

Dear Sukuh, I suppose you are correct. As does the writer of "The Kris" book: ..."which also used for executions...," So, the "executioner kris" is not only for executing dead penalty, but also for other purposes...

Amuk Murugul

23rd June 2008, 11:32 AM

Hullo again,

I was in a hurry before and made a mistake.
Assuming a bedor/paksi/tang of 12-13cm., both blades can be called 'Bangkinang' based on length only.
Also:
Cannot see from pictures, but if the gandi (front part of base of blade) of the longer one has a tikel halis/eyebrow shaped like an inverted comma, then it has the 'Bangkinang' form.
But, the thick tang makes me ask: maybe it is a Peninsular version ... or a revised keris ageung/large Wetan/Jawa?
Bahari should have the same form as Bangkinang, just shorter. So I am suspicious of the shorter one. Is it Bali/Jawa keris?

By 'duyung teeth', I assume you mean the male Dugong tusk ivory.

About keris executions:

Traditionally keris executions were done with keris as a mark of respect and with no specific form of such keris.
Execution was done from the back.

With the long keris, execution was done from the collar-bone area.
That is why the long keris is called 'penyalang', from the word 'salang'... a corruption of the word sasalang/clavicle/collar-bone.

Best

ganjawulung

23rd June 2008, 11:57 AM

...Cannot see from pictures, but if the gandi (front part of base of blade) of the longer one has a tikel halis/eyebrow shaped like an inverted comma, then it has the 'Bangkinang' form.

Yes, it has a kind of "tikel alis" shaped like an inverted comma near the gandhik. I will post the clearer pics later tommorrow. The blade is too heavily etched with warangan...

But, the thick tang makes me ask: maybe it is a Peninsular version ... or a revised keris ageung/large Wetan/Jawa?
Bahari should have the same form as Bangkinang, just shorter. So I am suspicious of the shorter one. Is it Bali/Jawa keris?

I am not sure, whether this is a Peninsular version or keris "Jawa Wetan" as you just mentioned. And the shorter keris, I don't think the shorter is javanese kind.The form of "greneng" is not javanese at all. Usually, javanese kerises have "dha" form greneng (like "dha" character in javanese alphabet). And this not.

By 'duyung teeth', I assume you mean the male Dugong tusk ivory.
About keris executions:
Traditionally keris executions were done with keris as a mark of respect and with no specific form of such keris. Execution was done from the back.
With the long keris, execution was done from the collar-bone area.
That is why the long keris is called 'penyalang', from the word 'salang'... a corruption of the word sasalang/clavicle/collar-bone.

That's what I meant, Kang Amuk. Dugong tusk ivory... Thank you for the useful information on "keris penyalang"...

Ganjawulung

VVV

24th June 2008, 04:26 PM

...the Bangkinang was developed in answer to the Portuguese rapier, mainly for use on horse-back (read 'pony-back')...Last of all, the bedor/tang had a flat section to prevent rotation.

I have heard this claimed before, but developed for the navy.
Do you have any source for this claim as I would like to know more about it?

I have never seen any panjang/penyalang with flat tang but that's maybe because I haven't examined any Javanese???

Michael

ganjawulung

25th June 2008, 04:33 AM

Cannot see from pictures, but if the gandi (front part of base of blade) of the longer one has a tikel halis/eyebrow shaped like an inverted comma, then it has the 'Bangkinang' form.

Picture from the gandik part of the blade. Like an inverted comma...

Amuk Murugul

25th June 2008, 05:52 AM

I have heard this claimed before, but developed for the navy.
Do you have any source for this claim as I would like to know more about it?

I have never seen any panjang/penyalang with flat tang but that's maybe because I haven't examined any Javanese???

Michael

Hullo Michael,

I was talking about the Bangkinang keris. At the time, Bangkinang was an even smaller place then it is today. It was a very isolated place (dense vegetation etc.) and formed one of the 'rantau'/outer-regions of the Minang empire (similar to the 'kejawen' areas of the Jawa empire). Most travelling was done on horseback.I don't believe it would've had a navy, so I don't know what navy you mean..
Perhaps I used the wrong words: '......the Bangkinang was developed in answer to the Portuguese rapier, mainly for use on horse-back (read 'pony-back')...Last of all, the bedor/tang had a flat section to prevent rotation...'.
I meant that the shape was influenced by the rapier and its length more suited for horse-back. Also, I meant that the tang was round, but that only a section of it had been flattened (e.g. in the middle or at the tip).
(BTW ... traditionally, tangs were not always round. They could be helical-twisted, rectangular, with a hole at the tip etc.)
Since the Bangkinang became popular throughout the region, it also became imitated by local smiths, who may or may not have followed it's protocol.
As for sources,what can I say? I am neither an expert nor an academic, so I don't file/document everything. What I know and believe, I have picked up along the way (especially during my time spent under the tutelage of elders at my kaboejoetan (centre for heritage/tradition).
Perhaps someone who is knowledgeable on the Minang Pagar Roejoeng empire will give you answers.

Best.

Amuk Murugul

25th June 2008, 05:54 AM

Picture from the gandik part of the blade. Like an inverted comma...

Hullo again,

Is that a ridge/backbone I see running along the middle of the blade?
If it is, then I wouldn't call it a traditional Bangkinang but I would settle for a panjang/penyalang.

Best.

PenangsangII

25th June 2008, 07:33 AM

Thank you Amuk, all this while I was thinking that bangkinang, alang, panjang were just names depending on where the keris was found. I'm interested to know more about keris bangkinang that has flat tang in the middle section. And it would be very interesting to know that this type was the Minang's answer to Portuguese rapier. From the information you gathered along the way, was there any description on how the bangkinang keris was used against the rapier? Was it used by the Minang ppl similar to the way the Portuguese used their rapiers?

Thank you in advance.

rasdan

26th June 2008, 09:38 AM

Hello everybody,

In the state of Perak this type of keris are also known as Baur. If i'm not mistaken, it's an Acheh word according to our forumite Raja Muda. He heard it during his trip there.

http://www.perak.gov.my/sultan/english/baur.htm

ganjawulung

27th June 2008, 08:59 AM

In the state of Perak this type of keris are also known as Baur. If i'm not mistaken, it's an Acheh word according to our forumite Raja Muda. He heard it during his trip there.

Beautiful pieces of pusakas. Were all the pusaka blades made by olden local smith? Or from somewhere else? But the sheath was localised. I see that the two last pieces, look like Mindanao sundang...

Amuk Murugul

27th June 2008, 11:40 AM

Hullo everybody,

Firstly, I am sorry for making a mistake earlier on. What I meant was that the hilt is 12-13 cm.The tang would be about 10 cm.
BTW... the hilt was traditionally curved and conical, tapering toward the nggania (base of blade); variations such as Tapak Koeda etc. was influenced by this keris' popularity in other regions.

I must say again that the Bangkinang was not developed to COMBAT the rapier; rather, it was as the result of the locals being impressed by the rapier i.e. their adaptation of it.

The Bangkinang would not have been used in the same way as a rapier. It would have been a mainly stabbing/thrusting weapon ( similar to the Soenda Pedang Tewek, which in turn was similar to a rapier, with a very slender blade but slightly curved toward its sharp inner edge).

FYI ... Bangkinang has strong links with the peninsula: e.g. the sultan of Melaka sought sanctuary there when he fled from the Portuguese; Datuk Bahaman/Seman Tanah of Pahang was of Bangkinang blood. Maybe more info can be gleaned from these areas.

Earlier I said I was suspicious about the shorter blade. It reminds me of the long straight keris from the Tengger, Eastern Java area (whose form has been extant since the 12th. - 13th. century and which also has a spine along the middle of the blade).

I'm sorry I can't be of further help.

Best.

rasdan

27th June 2008, 07:16 PM

Hi Ganjawulung,

I never seen the blades, even if I had seen them i can't tell the origin. Sorry.. The last two i think are Malay sundangs. There's an old photo somewhere in this forum posted by Mr. VVV (if i'm not mistaken) showing the Sultan of Perak with his followers. One of them is holding a Sundang.

kai

28th June 2008, 12:20 AM

Hello Amuk,

Thanks for your contributions!

The tang would be about 10 cm.
Are you sure?

Here's a pic of a pesi which seems to be unaltered and is only about half the length you give. (I'm going to post the exact measurements later.)

I may have seen a dozen other pesi of this keris type but all had unspectacular sizes. Any pic of those (partially) flattened pesi would be great, too!

Regards,
Kai

ganjawulung

28th June 2008, 03:39 AM

I never seen the blades, even if I had seen them i can't tell the origin. Sorry.. The last two i think are Malay sundangs. There's an old photo somewhere in this forum posted by Mr. VVV (if i'm not mistaken) showing the Sultan of Perak with his followers. One of them is holding a Sundang.
Thank you, Rasdan, for the useful information. Is there any significant difference, between Malay sundangs and Filipino sundangs?

Here's a pic of a pesi which seems to be unaltered and is only about half the length you give. (I'm going to post the exact measurements later.)

I may have seen a dozen other pesi of this keris type but all had unspectacular sizes. Any pic of those (partially) flattened pesi would be great, too!

(Additional info for Kai and Amuk) the supposed to be a "bangkinang" I've shown before, has a pesi/tang's size of 6,5 cm long, round but bigger than normal. But the supposed to be "bahari" keris, is quite much longer -- 7,8 cm but smaller than the "bangkinang". Here are the pics...

David

28th June 2008, 03:05 PM

Thank you, Rasdan, for the useful information. Is there any significant difference, between Malay sundangs and Filipino sundangs?

Just a technicality, but i believe that the word "sundang" is not specific to keris in the Philippines. It is a word used to describe many different swords. It seems that kris or kalis are more specific. :shrug: :)

kai

29th June 2008, 12:23 AM

Hello Ganja,

Is there any significant difference, between Malay sundangs and Filipino sundangs?
The scabbards are definitely Malay. Malayan keris sundang often have blades which seem to originate from Moro smiths; those of local Malay manufacture often have distinct features.

the supposed to be a "bangkinang" I've shown before, has a pesi/tang's size of 6,5 cm long, round but bigger than normal.
Yeah, that looks like what I'm used to.

BTW, my piece has a pesi length of 6.0 cm (2.36") and a blade (without pesi) of 51.4 cm (20.24").

But the supposed to be "bahari" keris, is quite much longer -- 7,8 cm but smaller than the "bangkinang".
Thanks for the pics. I have to admit that this one looks odd to me: It's certainly not a regular keris bahari and I suppose it's not from Sumatra nor Malaya. I know that Alan has quite a few distinct examples - maybe he can comment on Javanese styles?

BTW, are you sure, this is an old blade? For the time being, I even wouldn't want to exclude a recent Madurese origin... :o

Regards,
Kai

Alam Shah

29th June 2008, 01:13 AM

... Thanks for the pics. I have to admit that this one looks odd to me: It's certainly not a regular keris bahari and I suppose it's not from Sumatra nor Malaya.

BTW, are you sure, this is an old blade? For the time being, I even wouldn't want to exclude a recent Madurese origin... :o

Regards,
KaiMy opinion is with Kai on the piece with the longer pesi. The base area (sor-soran) seems suspicious. ;)

rasdan

1st July 2008, 06:29 AM

Hi Ganjawulung,

Sorry for the late reply. I have quite limited internet access at the moment. IMHO the main difference is the "bangun" of the blade. Its hard to explain in words actually..

ganjawulung

1st July 2008, 06:54 AM

Thanks for the pics. I have to admit that this one looks odd to me: It's certainly not a regular keris bahari and I suppose it's not from Sumatra nor Malaya. I know that Alan has quite a few distinct examples - maybe he can comment on Javanese styles?

BTW, are you sure, this is an old blade? For the time being, I even wouldn't want to exclude a recent Madurese origin... :o

Yes, Kai, quite sure it is not a recent one (from grasping the metal blade). Nor madurese origin. (I hope Ki Jayamalelo could comment on this blade. He has seen this blade when we met in Jakarta last Sunday... couldn't he?)

This more close up picture on the base of the blade...

Newsteel

1st July 2008, 09:44 AM

Ganjawulung,

I would categorized both kerises posted above as Keris Panjang. Basically it is the form and length that makes it such. You may have heard about keris panjang, anak alang and bahari. Typically most, infact 90% of this were found throughout Sumatra (Riau, Bangkinang, Palembang, Padang, Jambi, etc) and the Malay Peninsular (Malaysia). How can we differentiate the keris from which part/region is another question.

Keris bahari refers to the same form (dapur?) but normally less than 12 inches long. Length of 12-16 inches would be anak alang, and longer than 16 inches can be called a keris panjang. This is just my roughly guide.

Newsteel

1st July 2008, 09:55 AM

I thought that your keris panjang with kembang kacang is rather 'unusual'. I have seen many but obviously not all. Typically an old 18th - 19th century straight panjang (panjang lurus) would have no kembang kacang. Only keris panjang with luks (very very rare) would have kembang kacang.

The other panjang (with that 'inverted comma at the gandik) is more common. This inverted comma like is typical found in Minang and Palembang keris - bahari and panjang.

ganjawulung

1st July 2008, 08:18 PM

...Typically most, infact 90% of this were found throughout Sumatra (Riau, Bangkinang, Palembang, Padang, Jambi, etc) and the Malay Peninsular (Malaysia).

Thanks a lot, Newsteel for the valuable information on "keris panjang". And I think, it is interesting too to know more about Bangkinang. I found some interesting notes on Bangkinang in the past.

Bangkinang now, is only a sub-district in Riau Province, Sumatera (Indonesia). But in mid 16th to the end of 19th century -- according to a note -- Bangkinang was popular because of their spesific kerises. This model of kerises then had been imitated by keris makers in Bangka island, Belitung and the neighboring Kampar area. The form of kerises in these areas, was told quite similar. But the size of unique Bangkinang kerises, were the longest -- about 49cm to 68 cm. The form of warangka -- the upper part of the sheath -- was similar to keris sheath from Islamic state of Demak (Central Java) in the 16th century. Half moon curve, or "wulan tumanggal" (compare with the similar name but in different language in Malay, "dua hari bulan" sheath).

In history of Sumatera, Bangkinang was an old but important town. After the fall of Sriwijaya empire (around Palembang now), Bangkinang developped as an important transit place for traders from Sumatera Barat (West Sumatera), especially from Pagaruyung to Pekanbaru and to the east coast of Sumatera. It was told, that these West Sumatera traders, they brought and sold kerises from Bangkinang to Riau Island and even to Malay Peninsula...

It still needs more scientific research on this, and more research on historical sites as Candi (Temple) Muara Takus, and also old inscriptions (prasasti) in Batu Basurai, near Bangkinang to unveil the mystery of "keris panjang" origin...

rahman

2nd July 2008, 02:59 AM

In history of Sumatera, Bangkinang was an old but important town. After the fall of Sriwijaya empire (around Palembang now), Bangkinang developped as an important transit place for traders from Sumatera Barat (West Sumatera), especially from Pagaruyung to Pekanbaru and to the east coast of Sumatera. It was told, that these West Sumatera traders, they brought and sold kerises from Bangkinang to Riau Island and even to Malay Peninsula...

It still needs more scientific research on this, and more research on historical sites as Candi (Temple) Muara Takus, and also old inscriptions (prasasti) in Batu Basurai, near Bangkinang to unveil the mystery of "keris panjang" origin...

This is quite consistent with what the late Pak Bambang said of Bangkinang in his Ensiklopedi Keris. Of the temples/candis, a google search on Bangkinang can yield some info. Indeed, Bangkinang remained an important transit point between East and West Sumatra today as it was in the 16th Century.

Pak Bambang also credited the popularity of the Keris Bahari to its small size, which makes it easy to conceal.

The spread of the Keris Panjang throughout the Malay areas, as explained earlier, is only one wave. We have to also credit the Minangs who migrated to the Malay Peninsula and establshed the state of Negri Sembilan. Indeed, the keris panjang figures highly here as symbols of authority. According to researchers of Malay keris, the keris panjang is used as a keris penyalang (execution weapon) by the headmen and tribal leaders because only the Sultan has the power to order execution by beheading.

It is interesting that in the Perak royal regalia mentioned earlier, most of the keris panjang are named 'Orang Kaya', a title given to Malay noblemen.

What's the difference between a Sumatran and Malay keris panjang, or indeed of the anak alang and bahari? After looking over a few, I conclude it's in the presence or absence of the 'inverted comma'. The Malay blades have no punctuation mark :)

FYI ... Bangkinang has strong links with the peninsula: e.g. the sultan of Melaka sought sanctuary there when he fled from the Portuguese; Datuk Bahaman/Seman Tanah of Pahang was of Bangkinang blood. Maybe more info can be gleaned from these areas.
I hesitate on this comment by Amuk though. The Sultan of Malacca retreated to Johor after the Portugese invasion of 1511 and set up a sultanate that lasted until 1699 in the Johor Lama/Kota Tinggi area. I have no info on Datuk Bahaman.

Just my dua sen worth.

Amuk Murugul

2nd July 2008, 10:36 AM

...

I hesitate on this comment by Amuk though. The Sultan of Malacca retreated to Johor after the Portugese invasion of 1511 and set up a sultanate that lasted until 1699 in the Johor Lama/Kota Tinggi area. I have no info on Datuk Bahaman....

I know very little about peninsular history so please, DO correct me if I'm wrong. My understanding is:
In 1511 the sultan of Malaka fled to dependencies: Siak, Rokan, Indragiri, Kampar/Bangkinang, Riaoe and finally to Djohor.
When the Portuguese destroyed his base in Bintan in 1526, the sultan then retreated to Kampar/Bangkinang in Soematera where he became ruler of Pekantoea Kampar until he passed away in 1528 (He was buried in Pekantoea Kampar). He left behind two sons named Moezafar Sjah and Alaoedin Sjah II
Moezafar Sjah established the Sultanate of Perak, while Alaoeddin founded the Sultanate of Djohor, the successor of Malaka.

Best.

ganjawulung

26th June 2009, 04:16 AM

Dear All,

I just want to share pictures with you on my "keris panjang" collection for the last four years. I hope, some of them are keris bahari or even anak alang. Aren't they? Just for intermezzo...

GANJAWULUNG

ganjawulung

26th June 2009, 04:19 AM

These are more pictures on such kerises...

GANJAWULUNG

ganjawulung

26th June 2009, 04:21 AM

These are more close ups

GANJAWULUNG

ganjawulung

26th June 2009, 04:25 AM

These are more and more close ups of the hilt and base of keris area...

GANJAWULUNG

ganjawulung

28th June 2009, 05:14 AM

These are supposed to be Sumatran kerises, or some of them could be Bangkinang kerises. All have "double greneng" at their rear part. Do every keris panjang, bangkinang, bahari, anak alang kerises always have double greneng?

Here are some of variations of the supposed to be Sumatran double greneng...

GANJAWULUNG

Sajen

28th June 2009, 02:33 PM

ganjawulung

28th June 2009, 05:07 PM

all in my collection have also this double greneng.

sajen
Would you please upload your collection? Especially the keris panjang form, or bahari kerises...

Thanks in advance, Sajen,

GANJAWULUNG

erikscollectables

28th June 2009, 07:24 PM

Here is another panjang.

It is not mine but I do have it hone at the moment. The owner asked me to sell this one for him but I am tempted to buy it myself.

Expect to get another one that I already did buy last week.
As soon as it is here I will upload a picture.

Regards, Erik

Sajen

28th June 2009, 11:50 PM

Would you please upload your collection? Especially the keris panjang form, or bahari kerises...

Thanks in advance, Sajen,

GANJAWULUNG

Hello Ganjawulung,

your wish is my order! :D
Here my three panjang. The longest one is 58 cm long (only the blade without peksi) and have pamor, I think this is rare.
The small one is only 36 cm. Sorry that the pictures not the best quality, I take them very fast.
sajen

Sajen

28th June 2009, 11:57 PM

ganjawulung

29th June 2009, 06:44 AM

My Goodness,
... anytime if I want to see good examples of keris panjang, then I must go to Europe. Not to Suimatra anymore.

Thanks Erik, and Sajen for the picture sharing.

GANJAWULUNG

Sajen

29th June 2009, 05:39 PM

My Goodness,
... anytime if I want to see good examples of keris panjang, then I must go to Europe. Not to Suimatra anymore.

Thanks Erik, and Sajen for the picture sharing.

GANJAWULUNG

Dear Pak Ganja,

nothing to thank. And your examples also very nice.

sajen

erikscollectables

29th June 2009, 07:20 PM

Sajen

29th June 2009, 08:47 PM

Pak Ganja also many thanks to you for sharing these great examples!
One question my example had a ship made of horn, not wood.
Is this common with the crescent shaped ships?
The ukiran is of wood which I think in most examples is made of horn?

Regards, Erik

Hello Erik,

no, it isn't found so much that the wrangka is from horn, a second reason to buy it. And yes, the handles most of the time from horn.
My both big examples have handles from horn while the wrangkas from wood.

Regards,

sajen

ganjawulung

30th June 2009, 03:09 AM

One question my example had a ship made of horn, not wood.
Is this common with the crescent shaped ships?
The ukiran is of wood which I think in most examples is made of horn?

Ship? Do you mean the upper part of the sheath? IMHO, the common material is wood. But I have some upper-part warangkas which are made of horn, with fine grain. Not Sumatran warangka, but Tegal upper-part of warangkas (without gandars -- pictures below).

My keris panjang's handle is made of (buffalo) horn too...

GANJAWULUNG

VVV

4th July 2009, 01:35 PM

Interesting,

Here is an anak alang with the ship made of rhino horn and
the simle hilt repaired.

Michael

Sajen

4th July 2009, 02:22 PM

Interesting,

Here is an anak alang with the ship made of rhino horn and
the simle hilt repaired.

Michael

Very unsual hilt-repair, never seen something like this before.

sajen

BluErf

5th July 2009, 02:57 AM

I've seen repairs like this done in the peninsula. Yes, I have always found such repairs to result in unusual looks. :)

A. G. Maisey

5th July 2009, 05:27 AM

I have not been following this thread, but I've just scanned through it and noticed my name.

Kai, I do not know anything much about this subject, and I do not like to speculate, or really, even to comment unless I can back up what I say, so I have said nothing about the keris form being discussed here.

Yes, I do have quite a few of these keris, they are not all straight, several are waved, they are not all without pamor, the blade styles vary from what is shown here through to distinctly Bugis and Javanese blades. One I have is the state execution keris of Brunei dating from 1842, and it is like a very slim Moro keris. Scabbard styles vary from the typical Peninsula ones shown here to Bugis, Jawa, and unidentified.

I am inclined to think that this long blade style was probably pretty widely spread throughout S.E. Asia.