Identification and opinion about 2 Keris

[ericlaude]

Hello Everyboby,
I bought those Keris and I'm not an expert, I guess the first Warangka is not the original one, and I know the second is Javanese, can someone tell me the origin of the first and the age of they may have.
Thanks in advance.

[ericlaude]

Next

[Jean]

Hello,
The first kris has a peculiar blade with an oddly shaped pejetan, deep and full greneng, ada-ada, and ganja iras. The sheath and hilt look to originate from East Java and my personal guess for the blade origin is also East Java but I am not sure, other opinions are welcome.
Regards

[Gustav]

Like Jean said, the blade is roughly made, it is difficult to say something about the origin. Actually this is not a matter for a discussion, just a remark from me - the general blade shape is more Sumatran, as is the greneng. Selut looks Sumatran, such planar style hilts imitating Central Javanese hilt form are also to be found in Sumatra. Yet on the whole it could came from everywhere.

[Sajen]

Like Jean said, the blade is roughly made, it is difficult to say something about the origin. Actually this is not a matter for a discussion, just a remark from me - the general blade shape is more Sumatran, as is the greneng. Selut looks Sumatran, such planar style hilts imitating Central Javanese hilt form are also to be found in Sumatra. Yet on the whole it could came from everywhere.

This was what I have thought as well when I have seen the blade the first time, the blade, hilt and pendokok have a sumatran touch. :shrug:

Regards,

Detlef

[Jean]

Like Jean said, the blade is roughly made, it is difficult to say something about the origin. Actually this is not a matter for a discussion, just a remark from me - the general blade shape is more Sumatran, as is the greneng. Selut looks Sumatran, such planar style hilts imitating Central Javanese hilt form are also to be found in Sumatra. Yet on the whole it could came from everywhere.

Just for adding to the confusion, the base of the hilt (thick and rounded) and the greneng have some Balinese flavour... I see some similarities between this kris and the one shown on the attached picture, any comment?
Regards

[David]

Just for adding to the confusion, the base of the hilt (thick and rounded) and the greneng have some Balinese flavour... I see some similarities between this kris and the one shown on the attached picture, any comment?
Regards
Can you clarify Jean...are you saying that this example you are now showing is from Bali, because i don't see that? :confused: :shrug:

[Jean]

Can you clarify Jean...are you saying that this example you are now showing is from Bali, because i don't see that? :confused: :shrug:

Hello David,
Sorry for the confusion, my 2 comments are separate:
1. I find that the shape of the greneng of Ericlaude's kris is reminiscent of some Balinese krisses (see picture) but of course I do not say that this kris is Balinese. I did not notice the cup of the selut initially so please forget my comment about the base of the hilt.
2. I see some similarity between the kris from Ericlaude and mine shown on the picture (shape of the blade, ada-ada, ganja iras, greneng, and hilt especially).
Regards

[A. G. Maisey]

Just looking at the blade, I tend to think South Sumatra, but all the other bits and pieces look like a hodge podge.

The hilt has similarities with hilts from West Bali and East Jawa; the selut looks Peninsula or Sumatra and could even be made in a western culture:- is it turned from a solid block, or has it been constructed? The scabbard looks like rural Jawa or perhaps Madura.

There is absolutely no coherence between the separate parts of this keris that would encourage me to give any opinion at all on where it might have been assembled.

This is not to say it is not an authentic keris. Over the years I've seen some pretty peculiar keris that were 100% indigenous items. Mixtures of bits and pieces from everywhere, put together in some village that had no real major cultural influence from anywhere. Indonesia has somewhere between 17,000 and 19,000 islands, not all inhabited, nor habitable; Maritime SE Asia has thousands more. This keris could be from anywhere.

Not all marriages are evidence of dealers doing the match-making.