View Full Version : BIRD FORM KERIS HANDLES, SUMATRA
VANDOO
27th January 2011, 06:36 PM
I HAVE ATTEMPTED TO INCLUDE ONLY BIRD FORM KERIS HANDLES FROM SUMATRA. I HAVE EXCLUDED THOSE OF THE KINGFISHER FORM AS MY UNDERSTANDING IS THEY ARE FROM MALAYSIA. I HAVE SEEN THEM REFERRED TO AS GARUDA HILTS, WOODPECKER (GAYO), AND HUMMINGBIRD. THERE SEEMS TO BE A WIDE VARIETY OF FORMS THE ONES I CONCENTRATED ON HERE WERE THOSE WITH LONG BEAKS. THERE ARE A LOT OF SHORT BEAKED FORMS BUT I AM NOT SURE THEY ARE FROM SUMATRA. THERE IS A FORM IDENTIFIED AS BUGIS FROM SULUWEZI THAT CLOSELY RESEMBLES THE OTHERS SO IS INCLUDED 3RD FROM BOTTOM. FEEL FREE TO REMOVE ANY OR IDENTIFY ANY EXAMPLES NOT FROM SUMATRA AND TO ADD PICTURES AND COMMENTS. THE FIRST ONE WAS IDENTIFIED AS WOODPECKER. TWO EXAMPLES HAVE A LIZZARD ON THE HEAD WHAT DOES THAT REPRESENT? I CROPPED AND REMOVED THE MADURA HANDLE.
Sajen
27th January 2011, 07:43 PM
The one from ivory (Fig. 38) is from the north of Java or Madura and the one direct on the right from this is from Madura too.
Most of the shown handles are from Lampung apart from the first one, I think from Aceh or Gayo.
Regards,
Detlef
Sajen
27th January 2011, 07:54 PM
Here some of mine, they was shown in a other thread before but here again. The last one have lost his beak long time ago. :(
Sajen
27th January 2011, 08:20 PM
Here a similar one like the first you have shown.
VVV
27th January 2011, 08:52 PM
Here is my Burung.
VANDOO
28th January 2011, 05:19 AM
HERE IS ANOTHER ONE TWO DIFFERENT VIEWS, AND ONE DESCRIBED AS NEW BUGIS AND THE LAST ONE WAS LABELED TEGAL I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS??
I AM SURPRIZED AT THE VARIETY OF THESE ITS A PLEASURE TO SEE THEM. :D
David
28th January 2011, 02:17 PM
Barry, i suspect that your last one here might not have been intended as a bird, but instead one of the long nosed wayang character. I have a similar example which i definitely do not interpret as a bird. :shrug: :)
VANDOO
28th January 2011, 04:56 PM
IT IS SOMETIMES DIFFICULT TO BE SURE BUT I THINK YOU ARE CORRECT. I CERTIANLY SEE NO BIRD IN YOUR EXCELLENT EXAMPLE, THE ONE I POSTED HAS A LOT OF CARVED DESIGN ON THE FACE AND HEAD (FEATHERS OR HAIR)??
BUT BOTH SHURELY HAVE A BIG BEAK , I THINK I WILL NAME HIM CYRANO :D
DOES THE WAYANG CHARACTER HAVE QUALITIES LIKE CYRANO :)
David
28th January 2011, 04:59 PM
When the "beak" turns upward like both these example do i tend to question the bird attribution. Same goes for the tajong hilts which have long been described (mistakenly i believe) as "kingfisher" hilts. :shrug: :)
VANDOO
9th February 2011, 12:52 AM
HERE ARE A COUPLE MORE OF BIRD FORM, I AM NOT SURE WHERE THEY ARE FROM. THE IVORY PARROT IS IN THE COLLECTION IN THE K. L. MUSEUM. PERHAPS YOU HAVE SEEN IT BEFORE? BUT I DON'T GET TIRED OF LOOKING AT IT :rolleyes: SO ENJOY
A. G. Maisey
9th February 2011, 01:01 AM
Barry, Tegal is a town in Jawa.
sirek
9th February 2011, 07:31 PM
A polychrome cockatoo, from Bali
(or some sort of parrot species :shrug: )
GIO
9th February 2011, 07:52 PM
Here is my cockatoo.
Sumatra ? peninsular ? composite ?
GIO
9th February 2011, 07:56 PM
A polychrome cockatoo, from Bali
(or some sort of parrot species :shrug: )
Sirek, are you sure it is from Bali ?
I respectfully have my doubts
David
9th February 2011, 08:13 PM
Here's a recent Madura example i have shown before.
Gio, your blade certainly looks peninsula. Can't say for the hilt though.
Marcokeris
9th February 2011, 08:47 PM
Here is my cockatoo.
Sumatra ? peninsular ? composite ?
Very very nice. IMO peninsular :)
fearn
9th February 2011, 08:55 PM
Just a couple of zoological notes:
--Hummingbirds are strictly new world. The Indonesian equivalents are sunbirds (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunbird).
The other, more interesting question is why no one mentions hornbills in this context. The ones posted by Vandoo, VVV, and Sajen certainly look like hornbills to me.
Best,
F
sirek
9th February 2011, 09:50 PM
the story of the seller was: that he originally comes from bali
and that all parts belong together and are not composed
but I'm not knowledgeable enough to confirm this :shrug: ,
but I would like to hear someone else's opinion if the seller was wrong :)
VANDOO
9th February 2011, 10:21 PM
I AGREE THE HORNBILL AND KINGFISHER BOTH HAVE A LOT MORE CULTURAL IMPORTANCE IN THOSE AREAS. THE KERIS IN QUESTION WAS IDENTIFIED AS A HUMMINGBIRD KERIS IN THE BOOK BUT I WONDERED IF IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN A HORNBILL SUCH AS THIS ONE.
ITS TOO BAD THEY DON'T HAVE NATIVE HUMMINGBIRDS AS NOTHING ELSE CAN FLY LIKE THEY DO AND THEY ARE PRETTY LITTLE CRITTERS. I GUESS ITS ONLY FAIR AS WE DON'T HAVE HORNBILLS OVER HERE. :)
EVERYONE SURE HAS SOME BEAUTIFUL AND UNUSUAL KERIS. :) THE LAST ONE IS SURE NEAT IT HAS PHOENIX AND A LOBSTER OR SCORPION? I HAD NOT SEEN THAT BEFORE. :cool: I HAVENT SEEN ONE WITH A STORK FOR FERTILITY YET :D
David
10th February 2011, 12:56 AM
the story of the seller was: that he originally comes from bali
and that all parts belong together and are not composed
but I'm not knowledgeable enough to confirm this :shrug: ,
but I would like to hear someone else's opinion if the seller was wrong :)
I am fairly confident in stating that your blade is not a Bali or Lombok blade. The dress is also not like any Bali dress i know either by motif or design, though the shape of the sheath is somewhat similar to the Bali gayaman style sheaths. But it looks more likely to be from Madura is regards to the carving (though given the lobster motif it might be from Nova Scotia :))
The blade certainly looks Bugis to my eyes. :shrug:
David
10th February 2011, 01:03 AM
Sirek, i photo shopped a little of the detail into your shot for better reference. :)
kai
10th February 2011, 09:10 AM
Indeed, a Bugis blade IMHO.
The fittings look post-WW2 to me. To me the Bugis blade and fittings with Bali influence makes an origin from Lombok quite probable (with a more recent Madura composite being the other possibility); the non-traditional motifs may make it difficult to prove it one way or the other though.
Regards,
Kai
sirek
10th February 2011, 10:52 AM
Thank you for your effort and comment,
it's always nice to hear other opinions especially because I am not as experienced as most members.
I am convinced that the selling party has not always correct and complete information, but by the shape and size (and of course the story of the seller) I thought I recognized a Bali shape.
but it is possible to be completely different, therefore I appreciate the comment :)
Laowang
2nd March 2011, 01:40 AM
Adding my avatar to the collection. Not technically a bird-form, although certainly close enough in resemblance. Indragiri, I think.
Sajen
2nd March 2011, 10:05 PM
Indeed, a Bugis blade IMHO.
The fittings look post-WW2 to me. To me the Bugis blade and fittings with Bali influence makes an origin from Lombok quite probable (with a more recent Madura composite being the other possibility); the non-traditional motifs may make it difficult to prove it one way or the other though.
Regards,
Kai
Agree complete with you Kai. One thing is to add maybe, the selut seems not to fit well with the hilt.
Regards,
Detlef
vBulletin® v3.8.11, Copyright ©2000-2025, vBulletin Solutions Inc.