ottoman military drum

[mavi1970]

New aquisition, I know it is not an edged weapon, but I think it has its place in this forum. Just wondering of its authenticity, or is it new modern repro's hitting the market. Have seen 3 for sale anywhere from around 500 dollars to 900 dollars in the last year.

[David]

Why do you think this is Ottoman or military? :shrug:

[mavi1970]

they have been touted as being ottoman military drums from the mehter band. how true i dont know, the one's i have seen used by the military band are much larger and different, modern of course. Could these be older ones used.

[colin henshaw]

Nice piece - I think this is from the Sudan, perhaps Mahdist period. is the body made of copper or wood ?

[Tim Simmons]

I have one like this 21cm diameter. Looks a little smaller than yours but could be from many places in africa and even 20th century?

[David]

they have been touted as being ottoman military drums from the mehter band. how true i dont know, the one's i have seen used by the military band are much larger and different, modern of course. Could these be older ones used.
The reason i ask is because i have been a hand percussionist for 25 years, playing mostly congas and djembes. My rhythmic interests are mostly West African and Afro-Caribbean. This drum looks distinctly African in both construction and materials. Here are a couple of images of an Ottoman military drummer. This is not a particularly "modern" drum form BTW. This style of double headed "snare" dates well back to the middle ages.

[David]

How big is your drum BTW?

[David]

Note the West African drum to the right in this image. I believe they call these Bara drums.

[colin henshaw]

Here is an image from an old sale catalogue of a drum from Sudan (Darfur), with that same type of interlace binding.

A number were brought from the Sudan after the military campaigns there in the late 19th century, but the ones I have seen have the body made out of copper.

[David]

Colin, the shape of this drum is really found all over Africa. If you look carefully though you will notice some very distinct differences in the binding and the actual way the drum is headed, which may or may not point us away from your Sudanese example.
Mavi, i am still curious about what material your drum body is made from and what it's dimensions are. It looks like a large calabash in the photo. :shrug:

[mavi1970]

Hi,
sorry havent gotten back to respond, Christmas and blizzards etc. The width of the drum is about 17 inches and the depth about 11, and the body is made from hand flattened metal, does not look copper. the sound from it is deep and amazing for the size of the drum. I actually did see the Mehter band perform a few times so seeing their drums compared to this one, left me doubting of its ottoman origin. But you never know. I had to have this, and the price i picked it up for, it well worth it.
so are still thinking its african?

[David]

I think i may have solved this mystery. Though there are many African drums with this shape i believe that this is a kettle drum from India called a nagara drum.
http://www.google.com/images?q=nagara+drum&hl=en&client=safari&rls=en&prmd=ivns&source=lnms&tbs=isch:1&ei=edgQTdD1MIegnQfkkeijDg&sa=X&oi=mode_link&ct=mode&ved=0CAsQ_AU&biw=1440&bih=700
The problem arises because there is also a Turkish drum called a nagara which looks more like the regular parade drums. If you look through the image gallery you will see both.
So i vote that your drum is from India. :)

[colin henshaw]

David could well be right, as the ones from Sudan I have seen have all had copper bodies, although the shape etc of the drums were very similar...

[David]

Here is a video of the india nagara drum being played:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2kyAIapFaw

This is more likely the style of drum (also called a nagara) that the Ottoman military used, much like the drum in the earlier pictures i linked:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvOC39yA8po

[David]

Apparently the Sikhs also use a larger version of this kettle drum (which is still called nagara) so that could be considered, at least in part, a martial application. :)